What's the use of MS Update if customers get chastised when trusting it?

1) Saying « relying on the Windows Updates for hardware drivers should *not* be done » is essentially denying the very purpose of the Hardware section of the MS Update site. What is the purpose of MS Update if one can't rely on it?

2) Saying « Don't update hardware drivers unless it fixes something », thus reducing driver update to resuming something that was (or was assumed) working, is essentially denying any chance of progress or improvement. I was strongly against such deny a decade ago; sure facts now too often prompt to agree - at least when Microsoft is concerned - but not always, and anyway this should not be or remain the case.

3) When you try installing a driver that is not MS-certified, you get warned *by MS (in its OS)* that you are wrong. Then when you install a WHQL-certified driver *using MS Update site*, you are told again that you are wrong.

4) And when you notice the incoherence, MS-MVPs not only won't try to forward the problem up the ladder to management and developers until it gets fixed - but will even chastise you for not worshiping MS (staff or MVP-gods or else). Doubt it? see below the incredible "lessons" about it, and - cerise sur le gâteau - the final one about « Also - what did you mean by, " I knew I didn't need it but I wasn't sure "? » (and please don't laugh!).

5) We all should remember that MS MVPs (or other official "volunteers") are actually not as volunteer as regular users posting here, who OTOH are most often doing so without any reward of any sort (e.g. no travel or invitation or free software), even without any consideration or indulgence or friendliness or understanding their suggestions or even trying to understand them.

In conclusion I firmly request that MS management re-teaches their staff (and "volunteers" of all sorts) about:

- respecting customers' choices and preferences
- respecting *at all levels* MS statements, like the ones asking customers to trust MU and MS-certified drivers (developers' level: strive at making everything work as stated; MVPs level: of course tell users when things FAIL to work as stated, but don't pretend it is right to never trust it)
- be modest when facing customers (e.g. never try teaching life to them!); remember (as is well known in all mature markets, like cars, curtains, food, etc) that the *average* customer is *high above* the *average* sales or "support" staff (and even more above *average* "volunteers" of all sorts); and this, in education, in knowledge, hence accordingly in modesty, politeness, regards to others; hence the low-rank-looking customer is *generally* much more knowledgeable than he pretends. All this tends to be forgotten in immature markets (like IT currently).
- above all, be true in everything you say.

Versailles, Sun 18 Nov 2007 21:46:00 +0100


----- Parent Message (links are clickable) -----
From: Shenan Stanley <newshelper@xxxxxxxxx>
Newsgroup: news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windowsupdate
Message: news://msnews.microsoft.com/eZyIpNIKIHA.4228@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Fri 16 Nov 2007 13:03:43 -0600 (19:03:43 GMT)
Subject: Re: THEY GOT ME

joe wrote:
...Windows update is not meant to offer irrelevant and downright faulty updates. Defeats the purpose of the program completely

It has been explained before - many times - on these newsgroups by many different people that relying on the Windows Updates for hardware drivers should *not* be done. The hardware drivers that appear there have to be submitted to Microsoft by the hardware vendors anyway. They have to pay for the priviledge to have them placed there. There is also a process through which the drivers to be placed there have to go through to get the 'logo'/'certified'. That all takes time. By the time it is done - usually several releases from the manufacturer have passed by - sometimes solving issues with that original driver, sometimes just new features, sometimes nothing major.

Due to the fact that the driver provided by Microsoft's updates for products that are non-Microsoft can be older than 'the latest' -> it's usually better *not* to take the chance. Just because it passed through whatever 'process' to get the logo/certification does not mean there are not problems with it - problems that the manufacturer may have found and repaired in later versions of the driver that they have chosen not to pay Microsoft to test/certify/put up for them.

The Microsoft update process is (surprisingly - like everything else) not perfect. Things can and will go wrong - particularly when you throw in the pure number of variables you speak of when talking about computers and changing things across millions of them. You can help limit exposure to problems a bit by changing the downloads to something more manual where possible or getting the updates manually completely and reading about them first. The suggestions in these newsgroups about hardware drivers have almost always been the same:

- Don't update hardware drivers unless it fixes something (or you think it might fix something) you are actually having trouble with (or if you just have to have the new feature it might have in it.)
- When updating hardware drivers - get them from the manufacturer of said hardware. If Microsoft had nothing to do with the creation or support of the hardware originally - why trust them for it now?

Also - what did you mean by, " I knew I didn't need it but I wasn't sure "? It's one or the other. You cannot "know you don't need" something and then "not be sure"... ;-)

In that case (this is not just computer advice) from now own - I suggest you research and "be sure" before doing something if your gut is telling you that you don't "need it". ;-) The error here is not __just__ on "their part" for offering the update - but for those who accepted/installed the optional update(s) when they "knew [they] didn't need it". ;-)

--
Shenan Stanley
MS-MVP
--
How To Ask Questions The Smart Way
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html


----- Parent Message (links are clickable) -----
From: joe <joe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Newsgroup: news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windowsupdate
Message: news://msnews.microsoft.com/5A360693-02AE-4CF7-997F-586DCD518342@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Fri 16 Nov 2007 10:36:01 -0800 (18:36:01 GMT)
Subject: Re: THEY GOT ME

Yes I will definitly do that from now on. However this is clearly a mistake, an error on their part. Windows update is not meant to offer irrelevant and downright faulty updates. Defeats the purpose of the program completely


----- Parent Message (links are clickable) -----
From: realcestmoi <mdenie@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Newsgroup: news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windowsupdate
Message: news://msnews.microsoft.com/%23an1HRGKIHA.4752@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Fri 16 Nov 2007 16:20:50 +0100 (15:20:50 GMT)
Subject: Re: THEY GOT ME

Hi there,

Optional drivers, read the treath and do NOT take any non MS drivers from windows Update.

System restore can be usefull if you did not follow the advice.

Best regards,
Michel Denie


----- Parent Message (links are clickable) -----
From: <Joe>
Newsgroup: news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windowsupdate
Message: news://msnews.microsoft.com/2007111682720penile@xxxxxxxxx
Sent: Fri 16 Nov 2007 05:27:20 -0800 (13:27:20 GMT)
Subject: THEY GOT ME

THOSE BASTARDS GOT ME. WHY did i download that? I knew I didnt need it but I wasnt sure, I gave ms too much trust. Took me hours to figure this out. It disabled my mouse and keyboard. Even when you boot in safemode it still loads this ATIpcie driver. Only way I could find to fix it was to system restore from the windows disk !

EggHeadCafe - .NET Developer Portal of Choice
http://www.eggheadcafe.com
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