Re: Re: Microsoft's x64 strategy

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http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
In memory of our dear friend, MVP Alex Nichol
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"USNBrendon" <thenavyone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:9AA64935-26BB-4988-8C47-5A7EAE4ADDAC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>I have to agree with John Prevette's remarks and concerns! Microsoft is
>WAY
> off the mark on this one. The trend is towards 64-bit OSs
> anyway...period.
> With DUAL-CORE processors already in production, EM64T is almost OLD news!
> Come on guys, what gives here? I certainly understand the issues with
> limited drivers and support, yet I took all of this into account when I
> began
> the custom build of my new system--designed especially for Windows XP Pro
> x64!!! ATI, and even Creative had drivers out which take care of all my
> needs. Intel has provided the latest BIOS and chipset software, including
> the Matrix (RAID) software for my SATA devices! NOW I AM TOLD THAT I
> CAN'T
> HAVE THIS NEW OS BECAUSE I DIDN'T BUY A PRE-CONFIGURED PC with the OEM
> version of XP Pro (32bit), WHICH I ALREADY OWN ANYWAY??? Uh no. That is
> simply WRONG.
>
> I do wish to wage my COMPLAINT and total disgust with Microsoft for the
> current plans to release XPx64 ONLY to OEM channels...and furthermore, to
> only allow upgrades for people who bought AMD64 or Intel EM64T computers
> what
> SHIPPED with 32-bit XP Pro!!! That sucks guys...since I custom built my
> Intel rig just for the day that everything came together and MS finally
> released an OS for us! Talk about leaving me...and many others...out in
> the
> COLD. It is BITTER indeed!
>
> Microsoft...you MUST seriously reconsider the trade-in/up program! It is
> FAR TOO RESTRICTIVE, and I'm sorry, but I should not have had to purchased
> a
> pre-configured 64-bit box from one of your channel members in order to be
> eligible for the new x64 OS! I beta test for you, I provide technical
> support for countless Windows users in my profession, and I custom built a
> FLAWLESS system far superior to ANY of those offered by HP, Dell, or even
> Alienware. (Not to toot my own horn--I state only the facts) Now I find
> out
> that I am going to be gigged for NOT purchasing a pre-built system loaded
> with the same damn software I ALREADY OWN??? Not cool...not in the
> slightest.
>
> That is my rant for the week...although if I had ready access to Mr.
> Gates,
> I'd rant and rave DAILY until this ridiculous policy is changed!
>
> P.S. For those of you who ARE planning on sticking with the betas until
> they time out, it is becoming increasingly easy to find drivers for x64
> Windows with each day. Already ATI and Creative have released the
> appropriate drivers for my gear, and all that is lacking are some apps,
> which
> will soon be ported over anyway. There is hope yet! Hang in there.
>
> ;-) Good luck to all who are still using the betas, regardless of RC. I
> ordered the WinXP Pro x64 RTM version CD today as it was officially
> released
> for "TRIAL" beyond the beta testers/CPP. To this point I have been beta
> testing Win 2003 Server Ed x64 (SP1). I can't wait to have my dual-boot
> configuration with both versions of XP Pro 32 & x64. Of course, I am also
> an
> avid user of Cakewalk's Sonar 4 Producer Edition, and us pro audio guys
> have
> been waiting for a LONG time for this day to come!
>
> "WM" wrote:
>
>> One thing to consider - "porting" ones skillset from X86 to X64 is an
>> entirely different thing than X86 to Itanium. Unlike Itanium, from
>> the Windows perspective there isn't a huge amount to learn - it's
>> more about application compatibility.
>>
>> 4/16/2005 6:12:02 PM
>> John Prevette <JohnPrevette@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
>> message
>> <5FB142E7-37A2-453C-8C1A-924D6D7DEC75@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>
>> > Mike,
>> > From a Production perspective at a company, your replys are all
>> sound.
>> > What I am trying to do is learn 64 bit computing at home so I can
>> hit the
>> > ground running with it at work. If it is too expensive to
>> implement at home,
>> > then I can't learn it as easily and I can't feel comfortable
>> specifying it at
>> > work so maybe we don't go forward with it until I get the time to
>> spend on it
>> > at work (if I ever do). We are currently specing about 300,000
>> dollars worth
>> > of hardware that may or may not be 64 bit capable for one project
>> alone.
>> >
>> > At work, all technolgies that are "new" are restricted as to who
>> can "play
>> > with them". With x64, our Architecture group controls that so it
>> isn't my
>> > job to be an expert in x64 so I really can't mess with it at work
>> because I
>> > wouldn't be working on my assigned tasks. To get around that, a
>> guy learns
>> > on his own time ... gets an MCSE, gets x64 running at home, and
>> then can use
>> > that knowledge at work to the benefit of himself (and, of course,
>> Microsoft).
>> >
>> > Microsoft gave away thousands of copies of Windows Server 2003
>> Enterprise
>> > Edition with 25 CALS (NFR version) to MOC training students and
>> what was the
>> > reason ... to get the technology into the hands of the people that
>> will learn
>> > it and then specify it at their companies thus bringing in more
>> sales. Why
>> > not a program to give out 3 months worth of x64 NFRs to MOC
>> candidates this
>> > summer or maybe a copy to everyone at Tech Ed 2005?
>> >
>> > So, Windows 64 bit finally comes out and I go out and buy cheap
>> AMD
>> > hardware at Fry's and install RC2 and I'm running 64 bit ... the
>> learning has
>> > begun. I thought an easy next step was to find an NFR image for
>> x64 so that
>> > I could use my existing three NFR copies as the basis of a
>> permanent platform
>> > to learn with at home. What I am finding is that access is
>> restricted so
>> > Linux steps forward and Windows stalls just like 64 bit on Itanium
>> due to the
>> > hardware price.
>> >
>> > The answer that I am still searching for is whether I could use
>> my 32 bit
>> > key on a 64 bit NFR CD? Microsoft's web site tells me that if I
>> own a
>> > license to Windows 2003, then it can be used for the 32 bit or 64
>> bit version
>> > ..
>> >
>> > ----------------------------
>> > http://www.microsoft.
>> com/windowsserver2003/howtobuy/licensing/priclicfaq.mspx
>> >
>> > Q. How do I find the pricing and licensing terms for the 64-bit
>> versions of
>> > Windows Server 2003?
>> >
>> > A. The 32-bit and 64-bit versions of the software are the same
>> price. The
>> > license grants the customer the option of using either the 32-bit
>> version or
>> > the 64-bit version of the software. Client access licenses (CALs)
>> are still
>> > required to access or use the server.
>> > ----------------------------
>> >
>> > So, my question is, can I and how do I get a 64 bit NFR CD so I
>> can use my
>> > current 32 bit NFR licenses?
>> >
>> > As in my reply to the MVP about MSDN, cost is the key. Telling
>> the wife
>> > I'm buying an MSDN subscription for a grand isn't going to fly.
>> >
>> > p.s. -- Check your math ... 180 days is 6 months, not 4 but that is
>> still
>> > too short to have a permanent system at home that I can use to
>> learn with.
>> > ;-)
>> >
>> > John Prevette
>> > MCSE Windows Server 2003
>> >
>> > "Mike Brannigan [MSFT]" wrote:
>> >
>> > > "John Prevette" <JohnPrevette@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
>> message
>> > > news:3855691F-C6D6-4600-9C55-BB17E9829396@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> > > > Can anyone explain Microsoft's strategy with x64 from the
>> perspective of
>> > > > getting it into user's and developer's hands? For example,
>> Microsoft gave
>> > > > out thousands of 32 bit copies of Windows Server 2003
>> Enterprise with 25
>> > > > cals
>> > > > for MOC training students (non-expiring NFR version). The x64
>> version,
>> > > > however, you have to go get it from an OEM. One of the gripes
>> against
>> > > > Windows is that they haven't been 64 bit like Linux and now it
>> is finally
>> > > > here but the access is restricted to getting it through the OEM
>> channel.
>> > > > You
>> > > > can download the trial but with 180 days, it dies before you
>> get much
>> > > > done.
>> > > > What is the logic behind the restriction?
>> > > > --
>> > > > John Prevette
>> > >
>> > > John,
>> > >
>> > > The specifc nature as regards driver support for a robust
>> production
>> > > environment lends itself well to the OEM model in that they ship
>> you a
>> > > system complete with all hardware and supported drivers. This
>> will have
>> > > been tested as is supported by that OEM.
>> > > If you are using "self build" server then you can acquire the OEM
>> products
>> > > just as you do toady through the various distributors such as
>> NewEgg for
>> > > example
>> > > http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.
>> asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=368&manufactory=1149&DEPA=6&sortby=14&order=1
>>
>> > > (obviously once it reaches the distribution channels).
>> > > Developer have access to the products via MSDN subscriptions.
>> > > 180 days is 4 months - that should be long enough for your trial
>> and
>> > > evaluation. If not please get back to us detailing what trailing
>> and
>> > > evaluation process you have that runs for more then 4 months.
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > >
>> > > Regards,
>> > >
>> > > Mike
>> > > --
>> > > Mike Brannigan [Microsoft]
>> > >
>> > > This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers
>> no
>> > > rights
>> > >
>> > > Please note I cannot respond to e-mailed questions, please use
>> these
>> > > newsgroups
>> > >
>> > > "John Prevette" <JohnPrevette@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
>> message
>> > > news:3855691F-C6D6-4600-9C55-BB17E9829396@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> > > > Can anyone explain Microsoft's strategy with x64 from the
>> perspective of
>> > > > getting it into user's and developer's hands? For example,
>> Microsoft gave
>> > > > out thousands of 32 bit copies of Windows Server 2003
>> Enterprise with 25
>> > > > cals
>> > > > for MOC training students (non-expiring NFR version). The x64
>> version,
>> > > > however, you have to go get it from an OEM. One of the gripes
>> against
>> > > > Windows is that they haven't been 64 bit like Linux and now it
>> is finally
>> > > > here but the access is restricted to getting it through the OEM
>> channel.
>> > > > You
>> > > > can download the trial but with 180 days, it dies before you
>> get much
>> > > > done.
>> > > > What is the logic behind the restriction?
>> > > > --
>> > > > John Prevette
>> > > > Windows Server 2003 MCSE
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>>


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