Re: PAL va NTSC

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Hi Todd,

Well.. finally got the recording, and surprise.. jerkiness again. The
recording of my colleague has the exact same problem.

So, it is a PAL vs. NTSC issue..

Is there any way to get around this problem ?



"Todd Bowra [MSFT]" wrote:

> This is indeed quite probable; MCX devices do not currently support PAL
> (which is why they are only sold in the US/Canada/Korea).
>
> Does your friend have a different model TV tuner? If so, this will confirm
> whether this is a PAL issue or an issue related to your specific TV tuner.
>
> --
> This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
>
>
> "JW" <anonymous@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:O1YVOOEbFHA.3144@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> > MPEG2 compression is not screen resolution independent and if a program is
> > encoded in NTSC MPEG2 format then it will be decoded to NTSC format.
> > Similar if a program is encoded in PAL MPEG2 format it will be decoded
> into
> > PAL format.
> > AFAIK the XBOX extender is the only currently available that supports PAL
> > outputs.
> > Also since NTSC is at 60Hz and PAL at 50Hz this would cause problems.
> > So it is possible that your MCE recording and your MPEG2 recording are not
> > recorded in the same Format (NTSC vs PAL) and that is why one works and
> the
> > other does not.
> >
> > "Cageman" <Cageman@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > news:6B16F089-C6B0-4F0B-B09C-D86DD1811A91@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > First of all i would like to thank you both for the ongoing effort you
> are
> > > putting in to try to resolve this problem..!
> > >
> > > Well.. Even after a little beating, my colleague still has not provided
> me
> > > with a recording.. I will drive to his house later this day to copy the
> > > recording to a CD myself..
> > >
> > > SO, in short, the network could be the problem OR the tuner/MPEG encoder
> > > on
> > > the Hauppauge MCE500..
> > >
> > > Well, i tried a number of network configurations; The most simple one
> > > being
> > > a single cable from the MCE to the MCX (there is a little switch on the
> > > MCX
> > > which lets you cross-link the ethernet connection). I configured fixed
> > > addresses on both the Extender and the MCE, but no difference was
> > > noticeable.
> > > I performed these tests a while ago, so i will try this again tonight..
> So
> > > many things have changed since then, so who knows.. it might do
> something
> > > this time.
> > >
> > > Second, monitoring CPU and disk utilization does reveal a large number
> of
> > > interrupts, and consecutively a very very large number of Context
> > > Switches/second.. These numbers are higher when running TV on the
> extender
> > > than when running TV on the MCE directly.. Microsoft states that a high
> > > number of context switches can be caused by a faulty driver or by a
> badly
> > > written application.. since I have tried about every driver there is to
> be
> > > found, i am guessing the latter is the case..:-)
> > >
> > > Third, we can rule out a faulty/defective extender, since i own two
> > > extenders..! They both experience the exact same problems..! For
> clarity,
> > > in
> > > everything i test, only one extender is connected and running. Wired.
> > >
> > > Fourth, and maybe very important : I live in the netherlands. The TV
> > > signal
> > > in the netherlands is PAL, and i own the european version of the
> Hauppauge
> > > MCE500. But.. i have imported the MCX from the US, which (I guess) is
> > > NTSC..
> > > Could something be wrong with encoding/decoding from a PAL signal to the
> > > MCX
> > > ? Sorry for not mentioning this earlier, but i have absolutely idea if
> > > this
> > > could be part of the problem.. Still, MPEG plays fine, so i ruled that
> out
> > > earlier..
> > >
> > > to be continued.. shortly..!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "JW" wrote:
> > >
> > >> That certainly could be the cause, however, since the Hauppauge 500
> card
> > >> was
> > >> new last fall along with the MCE extenders it would seem that its
> encoder
> > >> chip would not encode properly for the Extender's decoder chip.
> > >> Another suggestion would be to compare the cpu utilization when playing
> a
> > >> live TV on his MCE system with no other activity going on with the cpu
> > >> utilization on the MCE system while watching Live TV on the Extender
> and
> > >> again no other activity going on on the MCE system and look for spikes
> > >> or
> > >> for unusual events in the even log.
> > >> We will certainly know more when he plays a program recorded on his
> > >> friends
> > >> machine.
> > >> And we will certainly feel better when the cause of the problem is
> > >> finally
> > >> found and eliminated.
> > >>
> > >> "Todd Bowra [MSFT]" <toddbow@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > >> news:uCIJPC4aFHA.1040@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >> > Gotcha; some MPEG decoders treat errors in different ways, so it's
> > >> > entirely
> > >> > possible there's something funky with his TV stream that's tripping
> up
> > >> > his
> > >> > MCX decoder that his PC decoder is making its way past.
> > >> >
> > >> > --
> > >> > This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
> > >> > rights.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > "JW" <anonymous@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > >> > news:exvGiN2aFHA.2124@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >> >> Since the first post stated that he could play Live or recorded
> > >> >> programs
> > >> >> directly on his MCE system without any problems I tended to rule out
> > >> >> the
> > >> >> tuner and I certainly do not have the knowledge about how MCE uses
> of
> > >> >> the
> > >> >> network and of its tests.
> > >> >> "Todd Bowra [MSFT]" <toddbow@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > >> >> news:%23yYSM9waFHA.464@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >> >> > It's certainly possible - bad cables/routers have been the problem
> > >> >> > in
> > >> >> > other
> > >> >> > cases.
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> > Here's why I'm inclined to believe that this particular case is
> due
> > >> >> > to
> > >> > his
> > >> >> > tuner:
> > >> >> > - MPEG file content plays fine --> suggests MPEG decode on the MCX
> > >> >> > is
> > >> >> > working fine (TV is MPEG-encoded)
> > >> >> > - Reducing the TV quality to Fair (~3 Mbps) has no impact on
> > >> > behavior -->
> > >> >> > suggests this problem is independent of bit-rate/network
> throughput
> > >> >> > - Network Performance Tuner tests pass --> suggests high data
> > >> >> > throughput
> > >> >> > is
> > >> >> > possible on his network
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> > --
> > >> >> > This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers
> no
> > >> >> > rights.
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> > "JW" <anonymous@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > >> >> > news:eQLc1duaFHA.2288@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >> >> >> Is their any possibility that bits are being dropped or
> > >> >> >> retransmitted
> > >> >> >> because of a poor or extra long cable or by a flakey port on the
> > >> > router?
> > >> >> >> Just a though as I have been monitoring this thread to see what
> the
> > >> > final
> > >> >> >> outcome is. Hopefully it is not a defective extender.
> > >> >> >>
> > >> >> >> "Todd Bowra [MSFT]" <toddbow@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
> message
> > >> >> >> news:u$veSataFHA.1660@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >> >> >> > For best results, the Network Performance Tuner should be run
> > >> >> >> > with
> > >> >> >> > no
> > >> >> >> > AV
> > >> >> >> > content being streamed to your MCX. That said, I doubt your
> > >> >> >> > network
> > >> > is
> > >> >> >> > the
> > >> >> >> > problem given the data you've provided.
> > >> >> >> >
> > >> >> >> > Please let us know how it goes when you get the TV recording
> from
> > >> > your
> > >> >> >> > colleague.
> > >> >> >> >
> > >> >> >> > --
> > >> >> >> > This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and
> confers
> > >> >> >> > no
> > >> >> >> > rights.
> > >> >> >> >
> > >> >> >> >
> > >> >> >> > "Cageman" <Cageman@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > >> >> >> > news:CF26D4FE-2DD9-4EF9-A684-969EBB4212FB@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >> >> >> >> Hi Todd,
> > >> >> >> >>
> > >> >> >> >> And the story continues..
> > >> >> >> >>
> > >> >> >> >> - Closed Captioning is turned off, both on the PC and the
> MCX..
> > >> >> >> >> - I monitored the network performance tab in Task Manager
> while
> > >> >> >> >> the
> > >> >> >> > extender
> > >> >> >> >> is playing live TV.. (not making use of the network
> performance
> > >> > tuner)
> > >> >> > I
> > >> >> >> > did
> > >> >> >> >> this again yesterday : network load is about 10%, according to
> > >> >> >> >> task
> > >> >> >> > manager.
> > >> >> >> >>
> > >> >> >> >> My colleague has not provided a TV-recording to me just yet..
> I
> > >> >> > punished
> > >> >> >> > him
> > >> >> >> >> for this, and he promised to give me a recording tomorrow..:-)
> > >> >> >> >>
> > >> >> >> >>
> > >> >> >> >> "Todd Bowra [MSFT]" wrote:
> > >> >> >> >>
> > >> >> >> >> > Given that a different NIC in the PC made no difference and
> > >> >> >> >> > that
> > >> >> >> > dropping TV
> > >> >> >> >> > to a lower quality level made no difference, I am suspicious
> > >> >> >> >> > about
> > >> >> > your
> > >> >> >> > TV
> > >> >> >> >> > tuner. Random other question - do you use closed captioning
> > >> >> >> >> > on
> > >> > your
> > >> >> >> > MCX?
> > >> >> >> >> >
> > >> >> >> >> > Also, could you clarify the below comment - are you running
> > >> >> >> >> > the
> > >> >> > Network
> > >> >> >> >> > Performance Tuner + TV on the MCX and then looking at the
> > >> >> >> >> > result
> > >> > in
> > >> >> >> >> > Task
> > >> >> >> >> > Manager on the Network tab?
> > >> >> >> >> >
> > >> >> >> >> > > Monitoring network performance while the extender is
> > >> >> >> >> > > running gives a network load of about 10-15%.
> > >> >> >> >> >
> > >> >> >> >> > --
> > >> >> >> >> > This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and
> > >> >> >> >> > confers
> > >> > no
> > >> >> >> > rights.
> > >> >> >> >> >
> > >> >> >> >> >
> > >> >> >> >> > "Cageman" <Cageman@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
> message
> > >> >> >> >> > news:0FD14C08-8297-45E5-BCE7-2C4FD570AFD3@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >> >> >> >> > > Hi Todd !
> > >> >> >> >> > >
> > >> >> >> >> > > Thanks again for your input ; sorry for starting a new
> > >> >> >> >> > > thread..
> > >> >> >> >> > >
> > >> >> >> >> > > To answer your questions and provide some information :
> > >> >> >> >> > >
> > >> >> >> >> > > About the tuner :
> > >> >> >> >> > > - The tuner is a Hauppauge WinTV PVR500MCE Dual Tuner. I
> am
> > >> > using
> > >> >> > the
> > >> >> >> >> > driver
> > >> >> >> >> > > included in the latest download from hauppauge :
> > >> > MCE_CD_v25.zip.
> > >> >> >> >> > > - I will copy a recorded TV show from one of my colleagues
> > >> >> >> >> > > and
> > >> > try
> > >> >> >> > this
> > >> >> >> >> > asap.
> > >> >> >> >> > >
> > >> >> >> >> > >
> > >> >> >> >> > > About the network :
> > >> >> >> >> > > - The card is a 10/100/1000 integrated network card on the
.

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