Re: NNTP and NEWS identifiers are NOT UNIVERSAL
- From: <shukur@xxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2007 20:04:15 +0200
"Michel Merlin" <michel.merlin@xxxxxxxxxxx> a écrit dans le message de news:
%23wKDMRdpHHA.2044@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Other locations for RFC1738 (Additional thanks since yours is the best IMO):
http://www.freesoft.org/CIE/RFC/1738/index.htm
http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc1738
http://www.zvon.org/tmRFC/RFC1738/Output/index.html
« The news: link means that...
A) the user needs to know of and use an NNTP server... »
According to http://www.freesoft.org/CIE/RFC/1738/6.htm it's the opposite:
NNTP is a subset of NEWS. Anyway it appears confirmed that both NEWS and
NNTP fail in the real world to be "universal locators" (or "uniform
identifiers").
Yes I typoed "suffix", it should read "prefix". Thanks.
« BTW I haven't reflowed your Quoted Printable on this
reply either... ; } »
I admit that I forgot this time to format all my indented paragraphs in
64-char, as I usually do to overcome the only drawback of Quoted-Printable
(and as I am doing above). I recommend you OTOH to use QP, at least in
discussions as this one, where we have long "URL wanabes" that are not sure
to work or not, which makes even more important to remove any possible
source of mishandling them.
Versailles, Sun 3 Jun 2007 13:42:40 +0200
----- Parent Message (links are clickable) -----
From: "Robert Aldwinckle" <robald@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Newsgroup:
news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windows.inetexplorer.ie6_outlookexpress
Message: news://msnews.microsoft.com/uehNZqVpHHA.3644@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sat 2 Jun 2007 17:12:40 -0400 (21:12:40 GMT)
Subject: Re: NNTP links in OE or 40tude Dialog (Plain Text)
<QP>
NNTP links in OE or 40tude Dialog (HTML)Thanks for your reply - and your
useful link. However, after first being happy thinking it brought a
solution, I was finally disappointed seeing it did not. Says your link:
« ...and thus nntp URLs do not designate globally accessible resources.
Thus, the news: form of URL is preferred as a way of identifying news
articles ».
</QP>
Which has never made any sense to me. The news: link means that
A) the user needs to know of and use an NNTP server
B) the server that the user currently is using has that Message-ID cached
How does that make it "globally accessible"? At least the nntp URL
syntax allows a poster to provide a link to where the message once resided.
Whether it was moved in that cache and might still be accessible on that
server using its Message-ID is another matter. <eg>
<QP>
And for the "news: form of URL", they are not "universal" either; my
numerous personal tests over years, and the few examples in the current
thread, are enough to make me think (so far, and while waiting for further
useful examples from you or anyone) that addresses starting with "news" fail
to work in too many cases to deserve anything like "universal"; I found none
working in more cases than the ones I am using (see "Parent Message" headers
in all my posts), which I would not call "universal" at all. Hence my
(rather short I admit) phrase "there is no URL (Universal Resource Locator)
in *news*".
I tested your links:
nttp://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windows.inetexplorer.ie6_outlookexpress/evv$Z87lHHA.4032@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
nttp://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windows.inetexplorer.ie6_outlookexpress/336180
Pasting the 1st one in the IE address bar does (in my case) bring the
correct item,
</QP>
Because you are using OE. That link takes advantage of OE's error.
<QP>
pasting the 2nd fails.
</QP>
Again, because you are using OE. The link was constructed to be used by
newsreaders which conform to the RFC.
<QP>
Both are not clickable in OE6 or IE6 (I didn't test in FF or TB), and little
known, hence IMO not reliable enough so far for daily use with tiers. In OE
there is no default-prepared "nntp" suffix
</QP>
Typo for prefix? ; )
<QP>
(OE only offers "file", "ftp", "gopher", "http", "https", "mailto", "news",
"telnet", "wais"); when writing in HTML (see HTML version of this post
below) I can edit this address into an "nntp" link, but it doesn't work
(opens an IE window with a 404 "The page cannot be displayed").
</QP>
Then you probably made a typo with the URL syntax. ; )
<QP>
I find it interesting though, and will consider it some time.
BTW, what do you call "WM"?
</QP>
WM = Windows Mail, Vista's successor to OE
BTW I haven't reflowed your Quoted Printable on this reply either... ; }
Robert
---
----- Parent Message (links are clickable) -----
From: "Michel Merlin" <michel.merlin@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Newsgroup:
news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windows.inetexplorer.ie6_outlookexpress
Message:
news://msnews.microsoft.com/%23yW%23XUUpHHA.2044@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sat 2 Jun 2007 20:37:35 +0200 (18:37:35 GMT)
Subject: NNTP links in OE or 40tude Dialog (Plain Text)
Thanks for your reply - and your useful link. However, after first being
happy thinking it brought a solution, I was finally disappointed seeing it
did not. Says your link:
« ...and thus nntp URLs do not designate globally accessible resources.
Thus, the news: form of URL is preferred as a way of identifying news
articles ».
And for the "news: form of URL", they are not "universal" either; my
numerous personal tests over years, and the few examples in the current
thread, are enough to make me think (so far, and while waiting for further
useful examples from you or anyone) that addresses starting with "news" fail
to work in too many cases to deserve anything like "universal"; I found none
working in more cases than the ones I am using (see "Parent Message" headers
in all my posts), which I would not call "universal" at all. Hence my
(rather short I admit) phrase "there is no URL (Universal Resource Locator)
in *news*".
I tested your links:
nttp://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windows.inetexplorer.ie6_outlookexpress/evv$Z87lHHA.4032@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
nttp://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windows.inetexplorer.ie6_outlookexpress/336180
Pasting the 1st one in the IE address bar does (in my case) bring the
correct item, pasting the 2nd fails. Both are not clickable in OE6 or IE6 (I
didn't test in FF or TB), and little known, hence IMO not reliable enough so
far for daily use with tiers. In OE there is no default-prepared "nntp"
suffix (OE only offers "file", "ftp", "gopher", "http", "https", "mailto",
"news", "elnet", "wais"); when writing in HTML (see HTML version of this
post below) I can edit this address into an "nntp" link, but it doesn't work
(opens an IE window with a 404 "The page cannot be displayed"). I find it
interesting though, and will consider it some time.
BTW, what do you call "WM"?
I thank you however for this interesting link (that I didn't know) and POV.
Versailles, Sat 2 Jun 2007 20:37:35 +0200
----- Parent Message (was in HTML - links are clickable) -----
From: "Michel Merlin" <michel.merlin@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Newsgroup:
news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windows.inetexplorer.ie6_outlookexpress
Message: news://msnews.microsoft.com/e9L3hNUpHHA.3952@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sat 2 Jun 2007 20:25:20 +0200 (18:25:20 GMT)
Subject: NNTP links in OE or 40tude Dialog (HTML)
Thanks for your reply - and your useful link. However, after first being
happy thinking it brought a solution, I was finally disappointed seeing it
did not...
............................
.
- References:
- Clicking News links in 40tude Dialog
- From: Michel Merlin
- Re: Clicking News links in 40tude Dialog
- From: Robert Aldwinckle
- NNTP links in OE or 40tude Dialog (HTML)
- From: Michel Merlin
- NNTP links in OE or 40tude Dialog (Plain Text)
- From: Michel Merlin
- Re: NNTP links in OE or 40tude Dialog (Plain Text)
- From: Robert Aldwinckle
- NNTP and NEWS identifiers are NOT UNIVERSAL
- From: Michel Merlin
- Clicking News links in 40tude Dialog
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