Re: Messenger Plus! - Let's focus on another Sacred Cow for a while

From: Jonathan Kay [MVP] (msnewsreplies_at_jonathankay.com)
Date: 10/04/04 

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 23:42:28 -0400

=)

I think it is an important discussion topic simply because of all the misinformation about
it. However, one thing I forgot to mention is that no one is forcing anyone else to use
Plus -- I know plenty of people that refuse to use Plus for this and other reasons.
____________________________________________
Jonathan Kay
Microsoft MVP - MSN Messenger/Windows Messenger
Associate Expert
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone/
Messenger Resources - http://messenger.jonathankay.com
All posts unless otherwise specified are (c) 2004 Jonathan Kay.
You *must* contact me for redistribution rights.

"PA Bear" <PABear@mvps.org> wrote in message news:%23G5bsJcqEHA.192@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
> Thank you, Jonathan! I was hoping to drag you into this, er..., discussion.
> --
> ~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
> MS MVP-Windows (IE/OE)
>
> Jonathan Kay [MVP] wrote:
>> Firstly, you have to understand the Messenger demographics. Do you really
>> expect a 14-year old kid in the Netherlands to open a PayPal account,
>> connect to their bank account and send money online for a piece of
>> software? Plus's largest bulk of users are not in North America nor do
>> they own credit cards; how do you expect them to pay? Also, "donation"
>> links rarely get much attention; you either charge for something or you
>> don't.
>> Secondly, Microsoft itself doesn't look too favorably on third-party tools
>> that are making a significant amount of money of their own free software. The whole
>> "legality" of Plus is actually questionable (although the EULA
>> can be interpreted in several ways).
>> Thirdly, there are plenty of "freeware"-like applications that have the
>> same sort of "sponsor" type model, everything from the banner ad within
>> Opera to some FTP tools I've seen. This isn't anything new.
>>
>> Finally, don't believe everything you read. I can find you articles that
>> say iPod's are delivery mechanisms for transporting people into various
>> cults or that Bill Gates is an alien. If you say no to the sponsor, then
>> the sponsor doesn't install; there is absolutely no basis and plenty of
>> work has been done by cynics in the past to disprove this.
>> ____________________________________________ Jonathan Kay
>> Microsoft MVP - MSN Messenger/Windows Messenger
>> Associate Expert
>> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone/
>> Messenger Resources - http://messenger.jonathankay.com
>> All posts unless otherwise specified are (c) 2004 Jonathan Kay.
>> You *must* contact me for redistribution rights.
>>
>> "Patrick Dickey--MSN Beta Tester" <pd1ckey43(removeThis)@msn.com> wrote in
>> message news:O8BRt5SqEHA.3848@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>> Hmmm.. interesting.. If it weren't for the 'sponsor' he'd be living in the
>>> street. I remember seeing a post about Messenger Plus on one of the
>>> anti-spyware sites where Patchou's response was basically "Too bad."
>>>
>>> Here's a thought that I've seen on a lot of other sites.. PAYPAL. Or
>>> StormPay. Your 6 million + members could donate 1 dollar, and you'd never
>>> have to work again.. But, that's not an option, right?
>>>
>>> I liked Messenger Plus BEFORE it installed a bunch of spyware crap on my
>>> computer (This was before Patchou stated it in his EULA). I haven't used
>>> it since, and I don't recommend it to anyone. Simply because I've seen
>>> articles that say where his 'sponsor' is optional, it still installs.
>>>
>>> Plus, I agree with Sandi about the "Pass-through toolbar". If I want to
>>> change my homepage, search page, and other pages back to what I wanted,
>>> then C2Media, MPlus, or whoever is the 'sponsor' has NO right adding
>>> another toolbar to my computer (for monitoring my habits).
>>> Patrick.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Smile... Someone out there cares deeply for you...
>>> "PA Bear" <PABear@mvps.org> wrote in message
>>> news:O2u9rWSqEHA.516@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>>>> For those wondering what all the flap is about regarding lop.com, please
>>> see
>>>> the following links:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.doxdesk.com/parasite/lop.html
>>>>
>>>> http://www.spywareinfo.com/articles/lop/
>>>>
>>>> http://www.spywareinfo.com/newsletter/archives/june-2003/3.php
>>>> (dated, admittedly, but even the current version of MP gives you a "drive
>>>> by" install of lop.com)
>>>>
>>>> What Users Say (Good & Bad) About MP
>>>> http://www.download.com/3302-2150_4-10320442.html
>>>>
>>>> <quote>
>>>> 26-Sep-2004 03:22:12 PM
>>>> "I've used this program for 3 years now."
>>>> This is awsome software that is now into the third version. I've used it
>>>> from version 1.2 without any complaintes. it actually runs more stable
>>> than
>>>> msn messenger itself. For all the people who complain about the OPTIONAL
>>>> sponsor it should just teach you to actually READ the EULA :). if you did
>>>> click to fast it is fully documented on how to remove it. This software
>>>> would be perfect without the sponsor but then patchou would be living in
>>> the
>>>> street. get over it you selfish people.
>>>> </quote>
>>>>
>>>> <quote>
>>>> 26-Sep-2004 06:52:12 AM
>>>> "Sponsor disguised as a EULA to trick people into installing..."
>>>> Although Patchou and his flock of sheep try to convince people that the
>>>> sponsor is easily uninstalled, this is not the case for everyone... Yet
>>>> Patchou and these 'loyal' forum members choose to show nothing but
>>> ignorance
>>>> and arrogance towards anyone who tries to say that uninstalling and
>>>> reinstalling plus, does NOT remove the sponsor... As a previous beta
>>> tester
>>>> and previous 'loyal' follower of Patchou and this software, I can
>>> guarantee
>>>> that the sponsor does NOT always uninstall without the help of third party
>>>> software such as Adaware... Patchou now makes enough money from people
>>> being
>>>> 'tricked' into installing the sponsor, that greed has taken over and he no
>>>> longer cares about the users of his software... Although Plus is a good
>>>> addon for MSN, I advise people to take particular care when installing so
>>> as
>>>> to avoid the installation of what is definitely spyware... I don't know
>>> who
>>>> you are trying to kid, Patchou, but it is just that...spyware... It is not
>>> a
>>>> toolbar like the google toolbar... It is intrusive and very hard to get
>>> rid
>>>> of... Therefore, it is nothing but spyware...
>>>> </quote>
>>>>
>>>> IMO Pachou is to be congratulated for attempting to clarify his
>>> relationship
>>>> with C2 Media (who *still* subtly bury malware in what's called a 'drive
>>> by'
>>>> install)
>>>>
>>>> Help with Hijackware
>>>> http://aumha.org/a/parasite.htm
>>>> http://aumha.org/a/quickfix.htm
>>>> http://mvps.org/winhelp2002/unwanted.htm
>>>> http://inetexplorer.mvps.org/Darnit.htm
>>>> http://www.mvps.org/sramesh2k/Malware_Defence.htm
>>>> --
>>>> ~PA Bear
>>>>
>>>> PA Bear wrote:
>>>>> Enough about the 'End of Free Hotmail' already. Let's dissect Messenger
>>>>> Plus! now...
>>>>>
>>>>> Sandi's take on Messenger Plus!
>>>>> http://inetexplorer.mvps.org/data/messenger_plus.htm
>>>>>
>>>>> Ready, steady, GO!
>