Re: XP Home rebooting randomly

From: WinGuy (no_spam_at_nomail.bot)
Date: 07/10/04 

Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2004 13:20:26 GMT

Hi, Janice.
To me, it does sound like some sort of hardware related problem instead of a
operating system software problem. The key to part of the diagnosis is your
observation that the rebooting doesn't occur unless the computer is doing
something more than "just sitting there". This sounds like a sudden power
off that is being initiated by the power supply electronics or the CPU
circuitry itself that is instructing the power supply to shut down.

Did you give that shop your wireless keyboard/mouse to use during their
testing? If not, try experimenting with using cheap "standard" substitutes;
individual wired keyboard and mouse (nice to have around anyway, just in
case of a coffee accident!)

How about internal dust? Does the fan on the power supply appear to have a
thick coating of dust? If so then so do its internal parts, and perhaps the
entire interior of the computer. Dust is a heat insulator, heat will then
accumulate on individual circuit board components and that is not good at
all. If dust has accumulated, carefully brush things in the interior of the
computer case and vacuum it, and just replace the power supply as a
precaution. While in there, make sure all plug-in cards are firmly seated as
well as any socketed components on the motherboard or on individual plug-in
cards (important: remove the wall socket cord before pressing on things that
might flex the motherboard and cause it to short to the bare metal case that
is behind it!) Dust or smoke residue will also harm floppy disk and CD
drives, over time, because it accumulates.

More than likely, though, I'd suspect the power supply itself has become
marginal and perhaps heat sensitive, or its overall power capacity is
insufficient for the hardware it is asked to support. Most are not that
difficult to physically replace, and are readily available at big places
that sell computers. If you replace the PS then go for one with more power
capacity than the one you now have. Around 350 watts maximum capacity is
usually sufficient for today's computers.

Some BIOS chips support temperature and some also support fan speed
reporting; if yours does then boot into BIOS and look for power voltage
reports that fluctuate out of tolerance (most are only +/- 10% tolerance).
Try opening and closing CD drive doors while observing the voltage report.
Fans should only make a sound of moving air, never be squeaky or make other
sounds, such sounds are sure indicators of impending failure or failure that
occurs as they heat up (bad bearings). Bad fans can draw very excessive
power supply requirements.

Another but more rare possibility is the white (or sometimes black) thick
conductive goo that conducts heat away from the CPU to the heat sink that
the CPU fan is mounted on. After a few years it may dry and become a heat
insulator instead of a heat conductor! This is a common problem with
desktops, and even more so with laptops. Then, when the CPU is unusually
busy the CPU heats up rapidly and excessively and it causes the power supply
to shut down as a safety precaution. Removing the old goo and replacing it
might help (it is not necessary to remove the CPU chip itself, just the fan
and heat sink that sits on top of it, to clean off the old goo and replace
it -- get the "heat sink compound" goo from any good electronics supply
store, probably even available from a nearby Radio Shack).

Be sure to practice anti-static-electricity precautions when ever you have
your computer case open. Most everything you could touch in there, except
for the bare metal of the case itself, can be super easily damaged by static
electricity. One zot will, at best, at least weaken a circuit board
component and shorten its life. Always have the power cord unplugged and
always touch the bare metal of the case (or wear a wrist strap that is
connected to the bare metal of the case) before touching anything to reseat
it in a socket, you don't want to flex an electrically live motherboard into
shorting against the bare metal case it is mounted on. Never touch the gold
or silver contacts of something that go into a socket, the oils on your
fingers can leave an invisible film that could cause electrical insulation
problems later due to a chemical reaction over time. Do not remove any
socketed chips, the pins might bend and trying to straighten them often
causes a pin to break off -- just press on socketed things firmly to assure
they are seated well. Heating/expanding and cooling/contraction cycles, over
time, cause socket things to "ride up" in their sockets. Ozone, unavoidably
produced by the power supply, causes an invisible chemical reaction at the
contacts level, especially between dissimilar metals, that acts as an
insulator. Carefully reseating socketed things is a good practice, every
year or so.

An even more rare possibility is a bad earth ground at the wall AC-power
socket. You can buy (or order) wall socket AC power wiring testers (usually
available from the bigger Radio Shack stores, too). Such testers have the
potential to save lives. Computers use "switching power supplies" that do
NOT function well if a bad earth ground exists, and something could
eventually self destruct because electrical surges do not get properly
dampened by a switching power supply that has a bad earth ground reference.
Also, use a "spike protector" but only at the wall socket, they are designed
to permanently short and cause a wall socket panel circuit breaker to trip
if a large power surge comes along, so putting them on an extension cord is
not a good idea as the extension cord could, in a very worst case scenario,
provide enough resistive voltage drop to keep the circuit breaker from
tripping and the extension cord might then greatly overheat and catch on
fire.

Most all of the above a good computer or general electronics repair shop can
do for you, and should do as part of diagnostics when someone complains of
sudden and unexplained shutdowns with or without a reboot (the reboot part
of the shutdown is generally a BIOS selectable function after a sudden power
off occurs).

Best wishes.

"Janice" <jem16@nospammail.com> wrote in message
news:ODGY0kmZEHA.2944@TK2MSFTNGP11.phx.gbl...
> My son's PC has started to reboot randomly. I took it into my local PC
store
> to have it checked out. They tell me that they have checked out the
memory,
> video card, hard drive, virus checking etc but could find nothing. In the
> three days they tested it, it did not reboot once! However I would have to
> say that it happens when my son is doing something, not just the PC
sitting
> there doing nothing.
>
> So I take it home, connect it up and it crashes just as MSN is
automatically
> signing in. I'm told it must be a piece of hardware that I'm using at
home.
> However all it's connected to is a monitor, cordless keyboard & mouse, and
a
> LAN cable.
>
> Event viewer shows up these problems - both mentioned to the PC store but
> nothing done about them.
>
> Event Type: Information
>
> Event Source: Save Dump
>
> Event Category: None
>
> Event ID: 1001
>
> Date: 17/06/2004
>
> Time: 19:47:29
>
> User: N/A
>
> Computer: GRAHAM
>
> Description:
>
> The computer has rebooted from a bugcheck. The bugcheck was:
> 0x0000007f(0x0000000d, 0x00000000, 0x00000000, 0x00000000). A dump was
saved
> in: D:\WINDOWS\Minidump\Mini061704-03.dmp.
>
>
>
> For more information, see Help and Support Center at
> http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/events.asp.
>
>
>
> Event Type: Error
>
> Event Source: atapi
>
> Event Category: None
>
> Event ID: 5
>
> Date: 17/06/2004
>
> Time: 19:45:34
>
> User: N/A
>
> Computer: GRAHAM
>
> Description:
>
> A parity error was detected on \Device\Ide\IdePort1.
>
>
>
> For more information, see Help and Support Center at
> http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/events.asp.
>
> Data:
>
> 0000: 0f 06 10 00 01 00 64 00 ......d.
>
> 0008: 00 00 00 00 05 00 04 c0 .......
>
> 0010: 03 00 00 80 00 00 00 00 ...?....
>
> 0018: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
>
> 0020: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
>
> 0028: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
>
> 0030: 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 ........
>
>
>
> Event Type: Error
>
> Event Source: Disk
>
> Event Category: None
>
> Event ID: 11
>
> Date: 17/06/2004
>
> Time: 21:35:35
>
> User: N/A
>
> Computer: GRAHAM
>
> Description:
>
> The driver detected a controller error on \Device\Harddisk1\D.
>
>
>
> For more information, see Help and Support Center at
> http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/events.asp.
>
> Data:
>
> 0000: 03 00 68 00 01 00 b6 00 ..h....
>
> 0008: 00 00 00 00 0b 00 04 c0 .......
>
> 0010: 01 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
>
> 0018: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
>
> 0020: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
>
> 0028: a8 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 .......
>
> 0030: ff ff ff ff 02 00 00 00 ....
>
> 0038: 40 00 00 8f 02 00 00 00 @......
>
> 0040: 00 20 0a 12 40 03 20 00 . ..@. .
>
> 0048: 00 00 00 00 0a 00 00 00 ........
>
> 0050: 00 20 37 82 78 f9 3c 82 . 7,x<,
>
> 0058: 00 00 00 00 70 6e 3d 82 ....pn=,
>
> 0060: 02 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
>
> 0068: 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 (.......
>
> 0070: 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
>
> 0078: f0 00 04 00 00 00 00 0b .......
>
> 0080: 00 00 00 00 08 03 00 00 ........
>
> 0088: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
>
>
>
>
>
> I've also got a similar error on "atapi" for the same IDE port. I've
changed
> the IDE cable but that didn't help.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> This is another I also saved before taking the PC in.
>
>
>
> Event Type: Error
>
> Event Source: System Error
>
> Event Category: (102)
>
> Event ID: 1003
>
> Date: 15/06/2004
>
> Time: 08:01:18
>
> User: N/A
>
> Computer: GRAHAM
>
> Description:
>
> Error code 1000008e, parameter1 c0000005, parameter2 bf877e1b,
> parameter3f223f818, parameter4 00000000.
>
>
>
> For more information, see Help and Support Center at
> http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/events.asp.
>
> Data:
>
> 0000: 53 79 73 74 65 6d 20 45 System E
>
> 0008: 72 72 6f 72 20 20 45 72 rror Er
>
> 0010: 72 6f 72 20 63 6f 64 65 ror code
>
> 0018: 20 31 30 30 30 30 30 38 1000008
>
> 0020: 65 20 20 50 61 72 61 6d e Param
>
> 0028: 65 74 65 72 73 20 63 30 eters c0
>
> 0030: 30 30 30 30 30 35 2c 20 000005,
>
> 0038: 62 66 38 37 37 65 31 62 bf877e1b
>
> 0040: 2c 20 66 32 32 33 66 38 , f223f8
>
> 0048: 31 38 2c 20 30 30 30 30 18, 0000
>
> 0050: 30 30 30 30 0000
>
>
>
> Is it hardware related or software?
>
>
>
> Janice
>
>
>

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