Re: spy/adware

From: Bill (Bill_at_noemail.invalid)
Date: 12/26/04 

Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2004 13:06:03 -0500

In news:entK2K36EHA.1524@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl,
Bruce Chambers <bruce_a_chambers@h0tmail.com> typed:

> Bill wrote:
>
>> Unless you've installed the newest version of AOL Instant Messenger,
>> aka AIM.
>>
>> Imagine my surprise, when after downloading it because of it's webcam
>> functionality, I found that it had also installed something called
>> "Viewpoint Media Player"?
>>
>> WTF?
>>
>> I read the AIM TOS, the FAQ, and the Privacy Statement. Nowhere do
>> any of them mention the fact that you'll also be installing VMP, and
>> there was no option to "opt-out" of installing it while the AIM
>> software was setting up. I thought I must have missed it the first
>> time, so I went back to all three of those pages and used the "find
>> on this page" function of IE and typed in the word, viewpoint. Nothing.

> As I said in my original post, there are some unscrupulous
> people/businesses out there. However, AOL is well known to always
> require the installation of their own proprietary software to use any
> of their "services," so an informed computer user shouldn't be too
> surprised by this. Be that as it may, even simple good manners should
> require advance warning.

That was my point. Along with the fact that *sometimes*, even if you *do*
read things you're agreeing to *carefully*, you can still get screwed over.
I don't know why, but for some reason I had expected AOL to be more
forthcoming about what they were about to install on my machine.

>> My questions are ..... How do they (AOL) get away with that sort of
>> thing? And what did I "agree" to, that allowed them to do so?
>>
>
> The AIM TOS gives them this permission, actually (emphasis mine):
>
> "Additional Terms and Conditions for other Services or Products
> You agree and understand that certain AIM Products, features and other
> premium services offered by or through AIM (including services from
> AOL) may be subject to *additional* terms and conditions or
> registration requirements. You agree to abide by these additional
> terms and you further agree that a violation of those terms while you
> are accessing those products with your AIM Screen Name or through an
> AIM Product shall constitute a breach of these Terms of Service."
>
> "Changes to the Service
> AOL has the right at any time to *change*, *modify*, *add* to or
> discontinue or retire any aspect or feature of the AIM Products
> including, but not limited to, the *software*, community areas,
> Content, hours of availability, equipment needed for access or use,
> the maximum disk space that will be allotted on AOL servers on your
> behalf either cumulatively or for any particular service or the
> availability of AIM Products on any particular device or
> communications service. AOL has *no* obligation to provide you with
> notice of any such changes. "

So what you're saying is, that there's really no way of knowing what *else*
will be included with any particular download, from any particular vendor,
so long as they have wording like that in the TOS/EULA?

> Also, remember that AOL's entire business model relies primarily upon
> its customers' almost total lack of technical knowledge. (AOL hasn't
> been called "the Internet on training wheels" for nothing.) AOL would
> not have expected its average customers to read or understand the TOS
> or a EULA, or, for that matter, to even notice that something else
> has been installed.

But I *did* read it/them. And I wouldn't even have cared if AIM had at
least given me the option *not* to install Viewpoint Media Player, or at
least make me aware that it was coming with the software whether I wanted it
or not. *That's* what bugs me.

I'm not real big on legislature, but there should be some kind of
International law that requires *all* vendors to disclose just *exactly*
what changes their software will make to one's machine. And it should be
*obvious*. Not buried in some, "We reserve the right to do whatever we
want, whenever we want" clause.

Sorry for the rant. I'm just not very fond of having things installed on my
machine without my knowledge or consent.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: spy/adware
    ... > I read the AIM TOS, the FAQ, and the Privacy Statement. ... > them mention the fact that you'll also be installing VMP, ... AOL is well known to always ... You agree and understand that certain AIM Products, ...
    (microsoft.public.windowsxp.basics)
  • Re: please, help to start in the right direction with a video phone
    ... Open AOL account? ... Buy cheap camera and microphone and install on my computer? ... >> Start with AIM and iChat A/V. ...
    (comp.sys.mac.system)
  • Re: *&#$ AOL
    ... > They do it even if you aren't an AOL subscriber. ... I grudgingly installed AIM in order to be able to chat with my son. ... smallest and least invasive install. ... default messenger/chat program, which seems like an innocent enough choice ...
    (sci.med.transcription)
  • Re: spy/adware
    ... AOL's business model is predicated ... modifying or updating the program I bargained for (AIM). ... If what you say is true, (and I've no reason to ... Am I supposed to take a snap-shot of my system, then install the program, ...
    (microsoft.public.windowsxp.basics)
  • Re: Be afraid! Be very afraid!
    ... Compared it with Yahoo! ... > I fired up AIM, and got the pop-up advertising the upgrade to Version ... > At this point I proceeded with the install. ... Messenger alert to upgrade to Yahoo! ...
    (microsoft.public.windows.inetexplorer.ie6.browser)