Re: showing code in vb2005

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Mike Williams wrote:
That's my point, though. Microsoft themselves have
probably put the export restrictions in place.

Exactly. That's my point. It is a Micro$oft scam. Amazon are in on it okay, but it is basically Micro$oft who are running the scam.

And again, I ask you, what proof do you have that Amazon are "in on it"? If a multi-billion dollar company comes to you and says "Do you want to sell our products given these limitations, or would you rather not?", it's really a yes/no kind of answer. It's not necessarily a conspiracy between the two of them.

Amazon.com is probably simply following those
rules so they don't get sued.

No. Not because they don't get sued! That's not it at all. Microsoft have no right to sue any legitimate retailer for selling a product, or for selling at at whatever price the retailer chooses.

You actually think that? Microsoft owns the product. They have every right to dictate to whom they will sell, provided that it's within the law. Since there are such things as import & export regulations, sales of products by country or even province are not at all uncommon.

While we're on the topic, it also happens that bikes, cameras, and any number of other things I've heard of over the years are roughly twice the price in the UK compared to anywhere else. Perhaps NEITHER MS or Amazon have anything to do with it, and it has more to do with duties, taxes, or something like that.

Not saying that I know or even believe that to be the case, but in the absence of definitive proof, it's something I have to take into consideration, at least.

They didn't "collude" on anything; they did what they were told to do by the seller.

.. . . and the difference is?

Collusion implies ill intent on the part of both parties. Doing as you're told so you don't get sued is something else altogether.

If the seller said "don't sell this product to the UK,
only sell this other one", then I would expect Amazon
would be obliged to follow that dictate.

But they are NOT selling "this other one"!!! They are selling exactly the same product with a few different little stickers on it here and there but at twice the price!

Of course they are...they haven't even bothered to change the language they're selling it to you in, but any manufacturer has the right to stamp "For Sale in <country> Only" on their product, and expect that to be obeyed. More often than not, it's done for purposes of international regulations or something similar, but that's not the only reason it can be done.

Besides, why do you believe that Microsoft have the right to dictate such things to retailers?

Because they do. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_discrimination#International_price_discrimination

Would you be saying the same thing if Microsoft had said, "don't sell this product to a homosexual, only sell this other one"?

Hmmm...HomoWindows...that has an interesting ring to it. :Þ But seriously, discrimination based on sexuality is illegal in many countries and frowned upon in many others. For right or wrong, price discrimination based on country isn't.

Why are you defending Microsoft and Amazon in this matter?

I'm not defending them, so much as I'm asking you as the accuser to fulfil the burden of proof. "The necessity of proof lies with he who complains." Or in other words, "innocent until proven guilty".

That said, I think it very likely that MS is practising some kind of less-than-honest price discrimination here. So far, you've presented no proof or even vague indication that Amazon is somehow "in on it", however, other than your gut feeling.

Since MS probably sells Amazon the UK version
at twice the price . . .

What UK version? I've just looked at my eldest grandson's computer which is running a full retail version of Vista which was purchased at a branch of one of the main computer retailers right here in the UK (just a couple of hundred yards away from the Grand National racecourse, as a matter of interest) and for which he paid the full extortionate UK price (my grandson, as with many kids these days, has more money than sense!) and it is as "Americanese" as it gets! "Windows Color and Appearance", "Favorites Folder", (note the missing characters!) all sorts of things! It is as American as apple pie!

And what did it say on the box? I believe I said somewhere along the way that the only difference was most likely the licensing agreement, and that everything else was identical. But MS and Amazon have to follow your country's laws when selling in your country, so it stands to reason that even if the contents are the same, they might well have a different box and a different price JUST for you. Don't you feel special? LOL

It's a scam alright. A Micro$oft scam. Amazon might be having their arm bent a little in order to persuade them to join Micro$oft in the scam, but that doesn't absolve them from blame. Although admittedly Micro$oft is the main culprit.

Personally, I suspect you're right that it's a Microsoft scam. I don't pretend to absolve Amazon of any blame in the matter, but neither do I believe that they're doing anything under-handed. "This product for sale in the UK" means Microsoft sets the price, and Amazon just sells it as they're supposed to. At least from reading Amazon's site, it looks to me like all they do is act as an order-taker; it seems Microsoft sets the price, the conditions, and everything else.



Rob
.

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