Re: Setting fixed task start and end date

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I might just not be seeing it, but it almost sounds like you have determined each resources task assignments and schedule and simply need a method to communicate them to him and get reports back on actual performance versus assigned. IMHO, using Project and Project server to accomplish that limited task is like hunting flies with an elephant gun, using Project Server as a timecard server more than an enterprise PM application. What does using the Project system to do this buy you that a simple email-based form system would not?

The gist of a Project management system is to determine the schedule so that you can know that the second floor bathroom will be ready on Tuesday for Joe Plumber to show up and install the bathtub. If you don't need that sort of scheduling, why use an application that is purpose built for creating them and then publishing them? Server is essentially the tool used to communicate those schedules on an enterprise level.

Fact is, as you've discovered, it is impossible to simultaneously set both task set and end dates in granite in Project. Each depends on a whole laundry list of drivers such as predecessors, resource availabilty, resource assignment levels, working time calendars, etc as you have already discovered. Even more subtly, even entering dates in the Start or End fields doesn't actually enter data into those fields - what really happens 'under the hood' is the user input is redirected and becomes either a Start No Earlier Than or Finish No Earlier Than constraint. Such a constraint sets the earliest something can happen but has no influence on whther it gets scheduled to happen later.

I really don't see how you can achieve what you want if you stay in the MS Project environment. Sad to say, your options seem to be either figure out a plan B or change your organzation's workflow to reflect a more conventional PM model.


"Pr4gm4tik" <Pr4gm4tik@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message news:A69C9DA6-8124-48BF-8BAA-B1C40936493A@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Thanks Steve,

However to reiterate what was said in the first post, the only reason we
even care about start and end dates is because of the limitation of Project
Server which will only auto-populate timesheets with tasks which are
scheduled within the same date range as the time*** period. We could care
less about scheduling, we are simply trying to get the tasks out of one
system, and into Project Server in a way that a user doesn't have to manually
add each task to each ***. To do that, Project Server requires us to
schedule the task.

That might lead one to believe that this entire thread belongs in Project
Server, however I am doing the scheduling completely in Project Professional,
because we have encountered some insurmountable bugs in the PSI interface
(the web service layer for Project Server) that prevents us from using PSI to
insert the tasks directly into Project Server. Thus, it is easier to work
against the Project Pro VBA object model, and let Project Pro handle the
publishing (since the project managers will need to be able to edit the
project anyway).

I do appreciate what you're saying about what Project is designed to do
versus what we are trying to accomplish... the question at this point is
whether we can possibly force Project to do something it wasn't designed to
do, or do we simply write our own, and I am trying to see if it is feasible
to do the former before embarking on the latter.


"Steve House [MVP]" wrote:

Point out to your boss that Project's design purpose is to create schedules.
It is NOT a tool designed to document and make pretty a schedule that has
already been determined. Task start and end dates are the output of the
program, not input data from the user. IMHO, if you are inputting tasks,
links, and resource and the dates Project insists on calculating are
different from the hard dates your client/boss wants, that's telling you
something very valuable. It's giving you a reality check that the
predetermined dates are impossible to achieve with the workflow and
resources you presesntly plan to deploy and unless you change some of the
physical forces that drive the task schedules your project is likely to
fail. You know the dates you need to hit - Project is intended to give you
an experimental model that can predict outcomes of the decisions you make so
you can ultimately figure out just what you have to DO in order to meet
those required dates.

Steve House, MVP

"Pr4gm4tik" <Pr4gm4tik@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:5924148E-B0A6-41FD-AEC9-6FB77FDDFE64@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> I'm unsure what made you feel the need to be combative. You suggested > I
> post
> to the server group, and I followed your suggestion and that's the only
> reason I posted there. You now seem to be contradicting your own > advice
> at
> this point and chastizing me for posting in both places.
>
> I had no intention of wasting anyone's time who was not inclined or > able
> to
> help, I'm simply trying to use the groups for what they are hear for, > and
> I
> posted an MS Project Professional question in the general group and was
> then
> asked to move it to the Server newsgroup. I was simply pointing out > that
> it
> was not a Project Server question; I mentioned Project Server to > provide
> insight into the higher level task I need to solve.
>
> Regarding letting Project do it's job, I understand what you're saying > and
> it's my personal opinion that Project is not the best tool for the task > my
> boss wants to accomplish. I suggested that I can develop a custom app > in
> C#
> in a relatively short that behaves *exactly* as desired, but there is a
> basic
> philosophy of integrate versus build here. If we cannot get Project > Pro /
> Project Server to behave as desired it makes an excellent case for
> developing
> a custom solution.
>
> To answer your question, the tasks do not have constraints currently. > I
> have experimented with constraints to see if they solve the problem, > but
> they
> don't. The constraint of As Soon As Possible is the default. I have
> experimented with all of the different constraint types and still have > not
> found a way to absolutely set the dates to, for example 1/1/2008 -
> 7/1/2008.
> Why on earth would I want every task to have a six month duration? > That
> leads me back to where Project Server comes in... it will only
> autopopulate
> timesheets with tasks if the task falls within that time period. These
> tasks
> are being imported into Project from another system, without scheduling
> information, so we need them to appear in the user's time*** without
> regard
> to scheduling. The six months timeframe is arbitrary, we need to be > able
> to
> set it to 60 days, or 2 years, or whatever is needed to ensure it > always
> shows up in the user's time***.
>
> If you or anyone can help, that's great. I'm uninterested in engaging > in
> unconstructive arguments.
>
>
> "Mike Glen" wrote:
>
>> So you want someone here to give you an answer and waste someone >> else's
>> time
>> in the server group?
>>
>> The only way to fix a date is to use the Must Start On constraint or >> the
>> Must Finish On constraint. Any others won't do. Are they the
>> constraints
>> you're using? In any event, you would do best to make them all As >> Soon
>> As
>> Possible and put deadline dates to alert you of problems. Project's >> job
>> is
>> to tell you want is possible with the data you've entered - let it do
>> it's
>> job.
>>
>> Mike Glen
>> Project MVP
>>
>>
>>
>> Pr4gm4tik wrote:
>> > Hi Mike,
>> >
>> > I have posted this in the server group as well, although I do want >> > to
>> > point out I am trying to accomplish this in Project Pro 2007, not in
>> > Project Server. Server plays into it in a sense, but it is the >> > thick
>> > client app that is adjusting the dates.
>> >
>> > "Mike Glen" wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hi Pr4gm4tik ,
>> >>
>> >> Try posting on the server newsgroup. Please see FAQ Item: 24.
>> >> Project Newsgroups. FAQs, companion products and other useful
>> >> Project information can be seen at this web address:
>> >> http://project.mvps.org/faqs.htm
>> >>
>> >> Mike Glen
>> >> Project MVP
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Pr4gm4tik wrote:
>> >>> I am inserting tasks into the project from another system using a
>> >>> .net utility running against the Project Pro 2007 object model.
>> >>>
>> >>> I need to set absolute start and end dates for tasks -- I do not
>> >>> want Project Pro to change these dates for any reason. I have
>> >>> turned off automatic calculation for the project, but it still
>> >>> seems to adjust the dates as it seems fit.
>> >>>
>> >>> The reason this is important is the project is being published to
>> >>> Proj Server 2007, and tasks can only be auto-populated in the >> >>> user's
>> >>> time*** if the task is scheduled within the time*** period, so >> >>> I
>> >>> need to make the date range wide enough to cover all possible
>> >>> time*** periods.
>>
>>
>>



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