Re: Resource vs. Task Dependency
From: Steve House [MVP] (sjhouse.remove.this_at_to.send.hotmail.com)
Date: 02/15/05
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Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:40:48 -0500
LOL - we actually don't disagree all that often. Most of the time we're
heading to the same solution. just coming from different directions is all.
-- Steve House [MVP] MS Project Trainer & Consultant Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs "Jan De Messemaeker" <jandemes at prom hyphen ade dot be> wrote in message news:epDbfM4EFHA.624@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl... > Hi all, > > It's a rare occasion so let it go on record: > I COMPLETELY agree with Steve. > > :-) > -- > Jan De Messemaeker > Microsoft Project Most Valuable Professional > http://users.online.be/prom-ade/index.htm > 32-495-300 620 > -- > Jan De Messemaeker > Microsoft Project Most Valuable Professional > http://users.online.be/prom-ade/index.htm > 32-495-300 620 > "Steve House [MVP]" <sjhouse.remove.this@to.send.hotmail.com> schreef in > bericht news:OEFK0y1EFHA.3924@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl... >> Maybe I'm just thick, but I'm still trying to grasp the advantage of a >> resource "dependency" the functions like a task dependency does. A task >> dependency is straight forward - we can't put on the rafters until the > wall >> are in place to support them, dictated by the law of gravity not allowing >> one to park the rafters in free space and then stuff the walls in > underneath >> them later. The predecessor task is thus controlling the time of the >> sucessor based on the dictates of the actual nature of the process >> itself. >> But a resource dependency is saying the that order and timing of the >> sequence is determined by the availability of the required resource and > it's >> the first of those two factors that I'm having trouble with. Yes, Jack >> Craftsman can only work on one of either polishing fids or carving >> widgets >> at any given moment and he's the only resource capable of doing either > task. >> Obviously they must be sequenced but the kicker in my mind is WHAT > sequence? >> If the order of the sequence isn't arbitrary - the widgets are components > of >> the fids and a fid can't be polished until its widget is fitted in >> place - >> then a task dependency is appropriate for sequencing them. If it is >> arbitrary - the tasks are completely independent of each other in terms >> of >> process logic - then leveling coupled with leveling priorities will >> accomplish the sequencing. I don't see the advantage of adding another >> dependency type that duplicates that functionality graphically. >> >> You say one would be able to see timelines driven by task dependencies >> versus on driven by resource dependencies but I don't see how it could be >> possible that they are different. For a task to take place both task >> dependencies and resource availability must be considered. All of the >> physical requirements for the work on the task must be in place and the >> resources who will do the work must also be present - switch off > considering >> either one in the scheduling and the resulting timing of the task is > bogus. >> A task dependency is driven by the physical nature of the process that >> creates the project's deliverables, It can never be switched off or > ignored >> and still be able to sucessfully complete the project - the rafters will >> fall to the ground if we lift them in place before the supporting walls > are >> three no matter how badly I, the Project Managee, might like it to be >> otherwise and no matter how much money it would save us if we only could >> pull it off. A project plan that switches off that link and creates a >> timeline assuming it could be ignored is just simply wrong and I don't >> see >> any use for it. As for seeing timelines when resource dependencies are >> taken into account - isn't that exactly what you get when you view the >> pre-leveled schedule versus the post-leveled schedule? In fact, the >> Leveling Gantt view gives you both on same chart with the pre-leveled and >> post-leveled schedules distinctly colour coded. >> -- >> Steve House [MVP] >> MS Project Trainer & Consultant >> Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs >> >> >> "JackD" <momokuri@gmail> wrote in message >> news:ux1Y3utEFHA.3596@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl... >> > If the links between tasks had some intelligence, rather than just two > end >> > points, type and lag, then there are a number of things which could be >> > done. >> > First and most obvious you could tell immediately if your project was > task >> > or resource limited. It would be trivial to have project calculate two >> > times >> > based on task vs. resource dependencies and tell you what the >> > difference >> > was. Second, you could pinpoint areas where adding/substituting > resources >> > would affect the critical path. >> > >> > The key to this is having links which have multiple properties so that >> > they >> > can be switched on or off, can be filtered and displayed by type, etc. >> > >> > Wouldn't it be nice to have leveling improved by this sort of thing? I >> > think >> > I posted about a year ago about some other types of task dependencies >> > which >> > would improve project. Critical path scheduling got it's big break from >> > the >> > growth of cheap computing power (which made it possible to calculate >> > networks which were too complicated to do by hand). With the exception > of >> > leveling (which is many years old) Project has not taken advantage of > the >> > GHz which are now available. Microsoft has stuck with a scheduling >> > model >> > which is decades old. There really is room for innovation. Working on > new >> > types of dependencies is one area for improvement. >> > >> > -- >> > -Jack ... For project information and macro examples visit >> > http://masamiki.com/project >> > >> > . >> > "Steve House [MVP]" <sjhouse.remove.this@to.send.hotmail.com> wrote in >> > message news:uUgEZntEFHA.2600@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl... >> >> A resource can't be two places at once and so out of a pair of tasks > that >> > he >> >> must do, one must follow the other. But *what* sequence? A link, to > me, >> >> indicates that there is a certain preferred order in the sequence. >> > Project >> >> can currently handle mandatory links driven by the nature of the > process >> >> itself just fine. But the order of sequencing required by resource >> >> availability is essentially arbitrary. Staggering concurrent tasks to >> >> resolve resource overloading is precisely what leveling does. Why > would >> >> adding another type of link to accomplish the same end result be >> > beneficial? >> >> What would a "resource dependency" link give you that leveling, >> >> controlled >> >> by leveling priority settings, does not? >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Steve House [MVP] >> >> MS Project Trainer & Consultant >> >> Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs >> >> >> >> >> >> "jhn" <jhn@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message >> >> news:B16ED020-A5DF-45D6-A23F-6B6CD65D6DAE@microsoft.com... >> >> > Can MS-Project differentiate between a resource and a task > dependency? >> > In >> >> > MS-Project there is only 1 type of dependency but it would be nice >> >> > to >> > know >> >> > if >> >> > that dependency is resource or task dependent--it would allow the > easy >> >> > update >> >> > of adding resources to crash the schedule and knowing which >> >> > dependencies >> >> > can >> >> > be redirected. >> >> > >> >> > This comes as a result of a posted question on 1/28/2005. JackD has >> >> > requested this before as well from reading his response with no > action >> > by >> >> > Microsoft. There is a claim that this can be done (although not >> > visually >> >> > with a link) by Steve House [MVP]--I have used the leveling engine >> > before >> >> > and >> >> > it only seems to work on simple classroom exercise-type projects. I >> > like >> >> > my >> >> > (and JackD's) solution better because management (who you ultimately >> > have >> >> > as >> >> > a sponsor) can quickly look down the column and determine which >> >> > dependencies >> >> > are real and which are resource based rather than switching between >> >> > resources >> >> > in the resource view. >> >> >> > >> > >> > >
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