Re: Can Media Player edit m3u files? What can? Done with MusicMatch.

Tech-Archive recommends: Repair Windows Errors & Optimize Windows Performance

Zach, thanks again for your help. I'm going to post a new thread called
"Why the Multimedia Paradigm is so Fouled Up". See below for my replies to
this thread...


"zachd [MSFT]" <zachd@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:eILUmH$ZJHA.1328@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

"wdsnews" <wdsnews.0640@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:OLy$nC8ZJHA.1352@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
But I'm telling you my complaints in the likely misplaced belief that
Microsoft might be looking and these suggestions and complaints might be
heard, assuming they're willing to listen.

I took them as friendly suggestions made in good faith, no worries. =)

There are two problems with this. First, the lists don't show up in the
Playlist branch of the navigation tree.

You're using WMP11, right? Right-click on "Playlists" and choose "Show
All"

Ok. The 'Show All' feature worked, but now I wonder what it would have
revealed before I added my playlist folder to the 'Monitored Folders' list.

However, when I choose 'Library' and select the root branch, I can see my
lists in the center pane.

Which specific Root branch?

I was clicking the 'Playlist' branch.

By default the root node of WMP11 only shows the major views and does not
show any content or playlists directly underneat it.

Unfortunately, this reveals an old bug which causes some lists to show up
two or three times. I think this may be a carry-over bug from previous
versions of Media Player where I noticed the same problem.

Yeah, that's probably a bug or configuration issue fairly unique to your
system. It can happen in odd situations evidently but is not the norm.
For example, none of my many systems are experiencing it. =\

How can you tell the source of a playlist? A good design would allow us
to right-click and choose 'properties'.

In WMP11, right-click and choose Open File Location.

ok. But that reveals another flaw that could be fixed by my earlier
suggestion... Why isn't there a "Folder Locations" tab in the 'Tools |
Options' dialogue? Media Player can't be made to use my existing playlist
folder. It demands to create a new "My Playlists" subfolder in a Music
folder that it ASSUMES is the same music folder where I send newly ripped
files. That's just simply an unmanageable house of cards. Too many
assumptions... too little user control.

....and right-clicking to choose 'Open File Locations' is not only
non-intuitive, it's beyond the understanding of any new user.

Another alternative is see the list of lists categorized by their source
and file type.

In WMP11 you can choose the Details view for the playlist node and sort by
File Path if you add that to the view using Column Chooser.

I like that.


I don't believe the player cares about "file type" for playlists - it's
not a listed sort/column option.

It should be... along with all MP3 tags, CDDB info, and file attributes.


How do you build a new playlist? Each time I try to add files to a
currently playing list, the files chosen from a folder replace the songs
currently playing.

Drag and drop onto the current playlist, they'll be added to that
insertion point.

I like that idea.


How do you build a new m3u playlist? All of the list creation features
seem oriented to creating proprietary Media Player lists. It's not
enough to edit old m3u lists. I want to create new ones without having
to first create a proprietary list.

So save out as M3U - M3U is kind of limited, so the player doesn't save
that way. I know of no way to force this issue, sorry.

ok. I found 'Save Now Playing List As...' in the File menu. Arghhh, but
look at all those folder assumptions and browse demands going on there.
There's another reason for a 'Folder Locations' setting.

I agree m3u is too limiting. Nevertheless it's the only currently universal
format. Anyway, a great media player would be format agnostic the way Word
is format agnostic.


Recently edited playlists show up in that quick list for easy access.
This isn't true. I edited at least two different m3u lists and neither
showed up until I added the playlist folder to the 'Monitored Folders'
list.

"playlists that are in the library", sorry - that's true for everything
the player does without question. One library to rule them all.. ;-)

you only have so many accelerators/commands to use. WMP uses ALT-S [to
save].
Yes, but that's MY point. They shouldn't change the definition of
important long-held user interface traditions such as using [Ctrl]-[S] to
save. Editing a playlist should be as simple as 'Load', edit, and 'Save',
without requiring any new learning from the user.

Not possible contextually, sorry. You're merging two concepts and will
have this problem. Having it shift between Stop and Save would drive
people bonkers. =)

The design paradigm is wrong. The player should use single keystrokes for
playing music. A single-handed [S] would be better for Stop than a two
handed [Crtl]-[S]. And the idea of changing the definition of long-held and
well-known user interface traditions is wrong unless there's a good reason
to change it.

The [Ctrl]-[S] should be for Save.


I'm sorry you disagree with my music management suggestions in the
previous message. Perhaps you don't want such features, but some of us
do.

I didn't disagree in any fashion, as you'll see if you reread what I said.
=)

I'm sorry for making you feel defensive.

There's been articles written on how hard it is to interpret people's
moods via email or electronic communication. You have totally and utterly
misread mine. =)

I'm a nice guy that was/is making an honest attempt to help you get
straightened out to accomplish your stated goals.

I recognize that. Thank you. You are, and have been a great help to me.

I can't force the player to do backflips for you, but I can explain why
some of its gymnastics (CTRL-S) make more sense than you think.

Now there's another one of my points; Media Player isn't an island to
itself. A great player would be a good citizen of Windows. Moreover, Media
Player should become one of the main apps for new users as well as
experienced users. The idea that it introduces contradictary ideas to
someone trying to learn the computer is one reason some people feel affinity
to the Mac. It hurts Microsoft.


But as you defend some of Microsoft's lack of features or bad interface
choices, it makes you appear in league with the mixed up thinking that
the multimedia professionals exhibit.

Sure, I've worked on the player and know most of the people here. But I'm
also removed from the player: all I care about is getting you moving
along. If you don't think the player is the be-all end-all, rock on!! I
just want you happy and understanding your computer.

I appreciate your help. I especially appreciate your willingness to
exchange words with me on this subject. In my next thread, "Why the
Multimedia Paradigm is so Fouled Up" I'll explain how much experience I have
with the computer and why some of my ideas aren't from left field.

I understand the computer and the market very well. I left Intel after my
frustration with a management team that wasn't willing to understand the
end-user market, and as a result shutdown Intel's PC Enhancement Division at
a time when Enhancements should have been a booming and profitable business
for a company in their position.


Taking a step back, this is ENORMOUS field. E N O R M O U S. There's an
immense amount to get right. You're going to get a lot of stuff wrong.
Third parties will accidentally and deliberately sabotage you. You pick
and choose your battles and try to get right as much as possible. The
player probably fails in all sorts of interesting ways.

Honestly, a complete paradigm shift is needed.

But that's why we're alive: so we get a chance to improve.

I love hearing you talk that way. LOL Yes. The opportunity has never been
bigger with Digital TV at its beginnings, the iPod bringing attention to
music files, Yahoo messing up their MusicMatch acquisition, and people
discovering their digital cameras need a nest to live in. Now is the time
to get it right.

Imagine if MediaPlayer were the front-end to one of the new Blu-Ray
jukeboxes.


The failures of the players as they stand don't bother me to the point
where I want to throttle it. Except for when it full-screens DVDs on
insertion. Then I would throttle it. =)

-Zach
--
Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.



.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: OT: Help! (MP3 questions)
    ... player supported folder view). ... But the Philips GoGear Spark apparently does. ... then you select that folder and it plays the contents of the folder. ... playlists *which will do exactly what you are asking for*. ...
    (uk.comp.sys.mac)
  • Re: Can Media Player edit m3u files? What can? Done with MusicMatch.
    ... By default the root node of WMP11 only shows the major views and does not show any content or playlists directly underneat it. ... I think this may be a carry-over bug from previous versions of Media Player where I noticed the same problem. ... I don't believe the player cares about "file type" for playlists - it's not a listed sort/column option. ... seem oriented to creating proprietary Media Player lists. ...
    (microsoft.public.windowsmedia.player)
  • Re: OT: Help! (MP3 questions)
    ... that depends entirely on how it implements playlists. ... player supported folder view). ... Or, she bought a castle kit, built a castle, want's a castle ...
    (uk.comp.sys.mac)
  • Re: Can Media Player edit m3u files? What can? Done with MusicMatch.
    ... I tried your suggestion to make Media Player display all my playlists and it ... I added the Playlist folder to my ... I can see my lists in the center pane. ...
    (microsoft.public.windowsmedia.player)
  • Re: OT: Help! (MP3 questions)
    ... (we call them cowards round these parts). ... She specifically asked me to help her find a player that had what I'll ... now call 'folder view' and it appears none of the Sandisk Sansa range ... If she was to make use of the metadata and hence playlists ...
    (uk.comp.sys.mac)