Re: Bug IIS 6 Anonymous Access

From: David Wang [Msft] (someone_at_online.microsoft.com)
Date: 01/18/05 

Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2005 01:52:51 -0800

I'm responding only to apologize and say that you are right -- my delivery
of the initial response was frank but blunt and could use some tact -- it is
something I do work on improving. Regarding the negative spin -- this
entire thread could be spun very negatively from all parties, so the more
words, the more ammunition for fireworks. :-) Ok, I am done now. 

-- 
//David
IIS
http://blogs.msdn.com/David.Wang
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
//
"Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
news:OrAOZwG$EHA.2608@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
"Wade A. Hilmo [MS]" wrote in message
news:%23mpO2PF$EHA.3368@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
: Pardon my jumping in, but I want to make a few comments on some of the
: technical and process topics here.
:
: Regarding the issue of finding bugs in IIS, there are a few product group
: members that read and respond to a number of newsgroups, including this
one.
: In most cases where one of use gets involved, we can help out with getting
: IIS to work the way it is supposed to.  This is good for the posters
because
: we can help resolve issues.  It is good for the product group because it
: gives is some feeling for how our product actually works in the field, and
: how it doesn't work.  We can use this information to improve the product
in
: the future.
:
: Occasionally, someone will report an issue that turns out to be a genuine
: bug in IIS.  When this happens, we can offer workarounds and we can make
: note of the problem.  This is certainly not a guarantee that the product
: will be fixed in a future version, but we do fix a lot of bugs (and make
: changes to product design) based on discussions on this newsgroup.
:
: If someone runs into a bug in IIS that they would like to see fixed, it is
a
: bit more complicated.  For a number of reasons - which I won't go into
: here - we need to get PSS to sponsor a hotfix release.  This is why we
refer
: folks to PSS when they would like to see a hotfix.  Note that this does
not
: mean that you have to explain your problem all over again to Microsoft.
: When I refer someone to PSS for this purpose, I have them give my name to
: the PSS engineer that handles the case - specifically so that they do not
: have to start all over again at working the issue.  (And once in a while,
: I've even made the fix and I'm just waiting for the customer to get PSS to
: kick off the process so that we can release it.)
:
: Finally, to be clear, referring someone to PSS for a hotfix does not
: guarantee that we will produce a hotfix.  There are a number of factors
that
: need to be weighed on a case by case basis.  For the purpose of my
: statements below, I am using this bug as an example, and only looking at
the
: technical factors.  If I understand correctly, my personal recommendation
: would probably be to not issue a hotfix.  The reason is that, once the
: problem is identified on a machine, it is not difficult to resolve through
: system configuration.  This issue would be a very good candidate for a
: Knowledge Base article (again, if I understand the technical issue fully.)
: Also, as David's response suggests, I would certainly recommend that we
fix
: this in the next version of the product - but as you have surmised, this
is
: not a guarantee.
:
: I hope that this answers some of the objective issues raised in this
thread.
:
: Thank you,
: -Wade A. Hilmo,
: -Microsoft
:
:
: "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
: news:OWJwc08#EHA.2192@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
: > "David Wang [Msft]" wrote in message
: > news:Ox94pAw%23EHA.4072@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
: > : I'm sorry if I offended you by being honest and frank and I apologize.
: I
: > am
: > : an engineer and simply do not want to put on a marketing/sales cap and
: > : mislead anyone by sugar coating the truth.
: >
: > All MSFT salespeople mislead their customers?
: >
: > : I acknowledged the customer's
: > : bug, noted that I will make sure it will be fixed in a future release,
: >
: > Entering a bug report is a personal guarantee?
: >
: > : and
: > : if you want a fix in the current release you have to engage PSS.
: >
: > Tell the story again to MSFT because once is not enough.
: >
: > : I thought I
: > : was doing everyone a favor by being transparent with the process
: affecting
: > : the issue at hand (how to get a fix for IIS6)
: >
: > "How to get a fix for IIS" is guaranteed if PSS is contacted.
: >
: > : -- hopefully dispelling the
: > : popular belief that Microsoft is arrogant and does not listen to
: > : customers
: >
: > It's a popular belief that MSFT is arrogant and doesn't listen to their
: > customers?
: >
: > : -- we listen a whole lot... but business does tend to drive those
: > : decisions, and the net result is that Microsoft appears to not listen.
: >
: > Perhaps just listening is not enough?!
: >
: > : Please do not get me wrong -- I agree with your points.  As someone
who
: > : tests software, I always want bugs to be fixed the right way, no
matter
: > when
: > : they are found, and as fast as possible.
: >
: > That was not my point.  My point was to be more compassionate with
someone
: > reporting a bug you have verified to be authentic.
: >
: > : I just happen to also see the
: > : reality side of product servicing and wanted to share some additional
: > : viewpoints.
: >
: > Implying reality is incomprehensionable on this end?
: >
: > : I realize that reality is harsh and that the truth can hurt, but
: > : what doesn't kill you should make you stronger.
: >
: > That's great but we're not out at the bar trying to pick someone up at
: > closing time.
: >
: > : The only safe response I can make to the remainder of your comments is
: to
: > : say that we are all making our best efforts to make the other party
: happy,
: > : within reason.  If that is unreasonable to you, then as in life, you
: > always
: > : have a choice as to continue the relationship or not.
: >
: > So much for safe after including the final sentence.  I'm a MSFT
partner.
: > Informing me I have the option of terminating my relationship with MSFT
: > because I think your comments are arrogant and unprofessional leads me
: only
: > to reinforce my views.  What I will terminate is this conversation and I
: > doubt you and I will have any in the future.
I understand the need to get feedback from the field and I obviously am not
privy to the process for bug fixes at MSFT.  While I am sure David's
intention was to be helpful, it was rough to read on this end, twice.  I am
willing to concede it is difficult to communicate in text alone.  Voice
communications can make all the difference in understanding one's response.
I am also willing to concede that David didn't design the bug fix procedure
and is subject to it as we are.  My responses were direct and possibly harsh
on that end also, although my feelings were stronger than I portrayed.
I appreciate you taking the time to respond and explain and I do thank David
for acknowledging the bug in the first place.  Without knowing the full
process and the impact of regression testing, surely I am biased in my
opinion as I can only judge the effectiveness from this end.  Because of
that, I first addressed my views regarding how it came across and only
offered examples from others [other companies] to support my argument.  My
initial response was based solely on the delivery and not so much the
message.  My second response was more to point out each statement he makes
as a possibility of how it can be received negatively on this end.  As to
the last line, in his response to me, I have already stated my views on
that.
-- 
Roland Hall
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