Re: Penetration of ASP.NET - Developers continue to use VB6 & ASP

From: Steven Burn (pvt_at_noyb.com)
Date: 06/17/04 

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2004 04:02:48 +0100

Errr....... there's a VB8 beta?;

"In 2004 Microsoft released a beta version of Visual Basic 8.0. "

Under "Evolution of Visual Basic" 

--
Regards
Steven Burn
Ur I.T. Mate Group
www.it-mate.co.uk
Keeping it FREE!
"Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
news:ecBsZWBVEHA.2320@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> I remember in 1991 when VB came out and how many said you couldn't really
do
> anything with it and how it had a short life.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_Basic#Criticisms_of_Visual_Basic
>
> It's de ja vu all over again!  (O:=
>
> --
> Roland Hall
> /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
> without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
> or fitness for a particular purpose. */
> Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
> WSH 5.6 Documentation -
http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
> MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
>
>
> "dotnetforfood" <dotnetforfood@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:64e12d46.0406161543.5cd762d@posting.google.com...
> : Joel Spolsky's new article "How Microsoft Lost the API War" at
> : http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/APIWar.html
> : describes how .NET has failed, how classic VB6 and ASP continue to be
> : preferred by developers, and how Microsoft has lost control of the
> : preferred API.
> :
> : You really should read the article. Here are some excerpts:
> :
> : <Joel Spolsky>
> : "And yet, people aren't really using .NET much.
> : Oh sure, some of them are..."
> :
> : "instead of .NET unifying and simplifying, we have a big 6-way mess,
> : with everybody trying to figure out which development strategy to use
> : and whether they can afford to port their existing applications to
> : .NET.
> :
> : "No matter how consistent Microsoft is in their marketing message
> : ('just use .NET-trust us!'), most of their customers are still using
> : C, C++, Visual Basic 6.0, and classic ASP, not to mention all the
> : other development tools from other companies. And the ones that are
> : using .NET are using ASP.NET to develop web applications, which run on
> : a Windows server but don't require Windows clients, which is a key
> : point I'll talk about more when I talk about the web."
> :
> : "if you're developing a Windows GUI app today using Microsoft's
> : 'official' latest-and-greatest Windows programming environment,
> : WinForms, you're going to have to start over again in two years to
> : support Longhorn and Avalon. Which explains why WinForms is completely
> : stillborn. Hope you haven't invested too much in it. Jon Udell found a
> : slide from Microsoft labelled 'How Do I Pick Between Windows Forms and
> : Avalon?' and asks, 'Why do I have to pick between Windows Forms and
> : Avalon?' A good question, and one to which he finds no great answer."
> :
> : "So you've got the Windows API, you've got VB, and now you've got
> : .NET, in several language flavors, and don't get too attached to any
> : of that, because we're making Avalon, you see, which will only run on
> : the newest Microsoft operating system, which nobody will have for a
> : loooong time. And personally I still haven't had time to learn .NET
> : very deeply, and we haven't ported Fog Creek's two applications from
> : classic ASP and Visual Basic 6.0 to .NET because there's no return on
> : investment for us. None. It's just Fire and Motion as far as I'm
> : concerned..."
> :
> : "the Web user interface is about 80% there, and even without new web
> : browsers we can probably get 95% there. This is Good Enough for most
> : people and it's certainly good enough for developers, who have voted
> : to develop almost every significant new application as a web
> : application.
> :
> : Which means, suddenly, Microsoft's API doesn't matter so much. Web
> : applications don't require Windows.
> :
> : It's not that Microsoft didn't notice this was happening. Of course
> : they did, and when the implications became clear, they slammed on the
> : brakes. Promising new technologies like HTAs and DHTML were stopped in
> : their tracks. The Internet Explorer team seems to have disappeared;
> : they have been completely missing in action for several years. There's
> : no way Microsoft is going to allow DHTML to get any better than it
> : already is: it's just too dangerous to their core business, the rich
> : client. The big meme at Microsoft these days is: 'Microsoft is betting
> : the company on the rich client.'"
> :
> : "Much as I hate to say it, a huge chunk of developers have long since
> : moved to the web and refuse to move back. Most .NET developers are
> : ASP.NET developers, developing for Microsoft's web server...None of
> : this bodes well for Microsoft and the profits it enjoyed thanks to its
> : API power. The new API is HTML, and the new winners in the application
> : development marketplace will be the people who can make HTML sing.
> : </Joel Spolsky>
> :
> : The only sentence in the article that I disagree with is:
> : JS> "ASP.NET is brilliant; I've been working with web
> : JS> development for ten years and it's really just a
> : JS> generation ahead of everything out there."
> :
> : Whereas in my eyes ASP.NET is not a "generation ahead", but merely a
> : Microsoft rewrite of some well-known Perl modules available years ago
> : that:
> : - use templates to generate dynamic web pages and
> : - encrypt form data.
> :
> : dotnetforfood
> :
> : classic ASP rulez!!!
>
>

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