Re: moving corporate database out of vfp



Thank you for your response.

I'm not being given a choice. I may or may not be given a choice of front
ends, so if you have points to make about why Ruby or Python are better than
VB, I'd be interested.

I had thought MS Access may have had extensions to VBA to give it a data
manipulation language, I'm getting the impression now that it does not. My
own belief is that the VBA development environment is generally friendlier
and easier to work in than the visual studio, but most people here didn't
seem to support that, and like you, didn't care for the idea of Access as a
front end.

thanks again,

Chip

"swdev2" <wsanders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:eMzmYZ8DJHA.4584@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Heya Chip.

Some Points to Ponder.

1. MS-Access was an end-user tool. It's Programming Language is VBA
(Visual Basic for Applications).
Ain't got no OOP, but is solely object based.

2. Visual FoxPro is not dead - it is Code Complete. There's a vast
difference.

3. ROBUST APPS are written with VFP as front end and MS-SQL Server as the
BackEnd.

4. If my Manager wanted me to program in MS-Access, I would leave the
company.

5. Using ADO.NET adds in at least one order of magnitude for system
complexity.
Regardless of what you write, it still is piped through yet another
intermediary process,
that you have NO control over, in order to RUN. When you are doing things
with
DATA and DATABASES, there are at least 3 conversions that occur when the
PROGRAM you've written is RUNNING. I can't rely on that conversion , in
real time,
to be accurate 100 percent of the time.

6. Take a Hard Look at Ruby.Net and python.net, if yer boss wants to do
something with the
Dot Something Architecture.

7. If you want to do data manipulation with MS-ACCESS, you are going to
be
doing stuff
with string manipulation in VBA and sql coding via 'passthrough'
run(ning).
The basic things
we do as VFP developers with the simple string manipulations of substr(),
rat() and others of
that ilk become CUMBERSOME in VBA script. Sure, it's possible, but it's
CUMBERSOME,
and you don't have an immediate 'running' environment for incremental
testing. (more on this later).

SQL Coding is already built-in to VFP, so if you know it already, and I do
mean PURE SQL without
xBase derivation added in, then you can code up the SQL code in VBA . But
since MS-ACCESS is
an end-user tool, the end-user gets a nice visual query tool to help with
making SQL code. It's a pointy-clicky
thing.

8. I wouldn't classify MS-ACCESS as a platform to write database apps,
but
MicroSoft and scads, nay
tons, of authors have been trying to convince the world otherwise.

9. Database Development, in a purist's world, does not include any front
end or client-facing tools.
It's the front end that you'll have to worry about, for creating stuff.

10. VFP mostly is used for developing Desktop Apps. If your Boss wants
to
stop using it, is he wanting
to get away from DeskTop Apps? Remind him of that wonderful client-server
paradigm using VFP
for the front end, and MS-SQL Server as the Backend. If no VFP for the
Company, then is making
a conscious decision to throw away the concept of DeskTop Apps? Or is he
hoping and praying that
VB.NET and WinForms will be the Right Replacement for the Desktop System
*YOU* already use?

11. If he's old school - he'll understand the concept of function points,
and function point computational analysis.
VFP has a lower FP than anything in the Dot Net Architecture, so it takes
LESS TIME to write something
in VFP than it does in ANY MS Dot Something language.

12. If he's thinking to change to Dot Something with SQL Server, he'll
need
to completely redesign the network
infrastructure to handle the ADDITIONAL IO that occurs between the
'running
computer', a server, and ms sql-server.

13. VFP is an authorized MicroSoft Solution.

Hang in There...

Would he pay for an evaluation of his infrastructure with going forward
plan? If so, tell him to
hit up Andy Kramek and Marcia Atkins (Adkins?) over at TightLine
Computers,
engage them
for two weeks.

Mondo Regards [Bill]
--
===================
William Sanders / EFG VFP / mySql / MS-SQL
www.efgroup.net/vfpwebhosting
www.terrafox.net www.viasqlserver.net

"Chip Orange" <Chip.Orange@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:#h6Or32DJHA.1832@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Thank John.

First, I've already been told it's broke, and my opinion isn't being
asked
about that.

We have one of those site licenses for all MS office and server products,
I'm pretty sure Access is covered. If it isn't that could make the
decision.

I'm trying to explain I understand what a gp program language
environment,
using ado.net, is like. It seems possible, but more difficult, to write
database apps that way.

What I know little to nothing about is Access. Does it possess features
or
a language designed for data manipulation, that would work with an sql
back
end, which would make it preferable for database development?

Thank you.

Chip


"john3" <jgarmon.work@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:e8651e56-60f4-46cd-a478-258607561028@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
On Sep 3, 3:50 pm, "Chip Orange" <Chip.Ora...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
You were able to accommodate to the changes then; I don't see why you
can't now. It's not a big deal. We're programmers: we read manuals,
learn new techniques, and write code. That's what we do.

Yes; quite right. However, my boss asked me to find out some
information
on
whether use of MS Access would be best as a front end development
system,
or
vb.net.

He is committed to a MS solution, and I'd say he was committed to .net
until
I mentioned MS Access may make a better development platform, given
it's
a
db package and not a gp programming language.

All the points made here are good ones, but I would appreciate very
specific
commentary on just this question so I can complete this task.

thank you for all your help.

Chip

If I am not mistaken Access does not bestow distribution rights to the
developer, so every user will have to buy Access. VFP apps that you
write belong to your company and can be freely redistributed. This is
a major cost to absorb for arguably questionable reasons.

If it ain't broke, why fix it!
Good Luck!
john3







.



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