Re: The New Linux Economy

Tech-Archive recommends: Repair Windows Errors & Optimize Windows Performance

From: Jim Richardson (warlock_at_eskimo.com)
Date: 02/24/04 

Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:06:54 -0800

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On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:57:46 -0000,
 John <timneyj@despammed.com> wrote:
>> Speaking for myself, I have spent quite a tidy sum personaly, on
>> Linux distros, and software I use with Linux. More in fact, than I
>> have spent on Microsoft equivilents. But then, I am happy to pay for
>> software that works.
>
> Me too ........... although I must admit I personally buy very little
> software as I rarely find its worth the money - regardless of where it
> comes from.
>

Too much of it is worth less than they want you to pay for it, that's
true.

<snip>

>> When OSS is gratis, it is as a side effect of libre. Nothing more,
>> nothing less.
>
>> To claim that "nothing is free because you have to do (whatever) to
>> use it" is foolish. But ok, I'll play that game.
>
>> For me, the cost of using Microsoft software, is too high, not just
>> in purchase price (which ranges from negligible to OMFG!) but in the
>> effort I have to go to, to get it to actually do what I want.
>
> Now you see I'm entirely the opposite end of the tree, as my support
> costs are almost nil for my MS kit, it would take me longer to support
> the linux box I have, and thus cost me more in support time and setup
> cost. The boxes I have rearely get taken down. But I'm more familiar
> with the MS kit I have than the Linux kit I have.
>

There's certainly an amount of "investment" in the software you use. Be
it OSS, CSS or whatever. It was quite a change for me when I switched to
Linux at first, not difficult, and it was definately worth it, but there
was a "hump" to get over at first. As there is anytime you change from
old, to new.

>> I make no claims to "like" Microsoft software, Excel was ok, Word
>> is... usable, FSVO, and Outlook/Outlook Express? (shudder). None of
>> them are worth their initial purchase cost to me, let alone the cost
>> in productivity drop. (Please don't mention OWA, I just ate)
>
> I do like Open Office and I've even recommended it as a replacement
> for MS office, now that I can see as being a string contender for
> replacing my installation of Word etc. Until my office installation
> breaks though it'll sit where it is.......
>

I have not yet found something that OO can't handle, compared to
MS-Office, but I don't consider myself a "power" user of either suite. I
tend to use spreadsheets, python, and editors, not office suites, and
rarely, word processors.

<snip>

>> IBM happily sends me a DVD or CDs full of the whole websphere suite.
>> Why? because they hope I will use it, and recommend it to others.
>> Funny thing is, last I checked, websphere used Apache for it's
>> httpd/s dæmon. Apache, if you may recall, is the single most popular
>> webserver on the planet, dwarfing all other entrants, combined. IBM
>> manages to charge a pretty penny for websphere deployments, despite
>> relying on a significant amount of OSS.
>
> Yup.....they are in the business of selling consultancy and tin. They
> will happily sell you Microsoft consultancy and HP tin if it would
> make them a profit I would expect.
>

Of course, which simply drives home the point, that there's lots of
money to be made with OSS.

>> Even Microsoft itself relies on OSS software, although it doesn't
>> like to talk much about it. Akamai, a service which Microsoft uses to
>> help ensure site availability of the various microsoft.com sites,
>> runs on Linux, with apache. The could easily have run *BSD of course.
>> But it's unlikely that they could maintain a decent margin, if they
>> were paying licence fees to Microsoft for each machine.
>
> Yep- they keep that one as hidden as they can dont they......
>

It's not the only area, they also sell OSS, something else they don't
like to talk much about, especially after their "GPL is
unamerican/cancer/viral/etc" spewings.

>> > My biggest gripe here would be why the manufactureres if your
>> > S3/ProSavage chipset board didn't have a Linux driver in the first
>> > place. Pity the open source community is indirectly doing the work
>> > for this company and not getting paid for it, its the S3
>> > manufacturer who is creaming it in here- the good will of the open
>> > source community will save them a lot of money and hike their
>> > profits.
>>
>>
>> Agreed, they are making a big mistake. But I for one don't care if
>> they write a closed source driver, I would be more satisfied with
>> them releasing the info needed to write an OSS driver.
>>
>> I can't afford to rely for support, on a company that might go under,
>> or drop the product.
>>
>> I am happy to pay for quality, I am not happy to pay for schlock.
>> Most software (closed or open source) is schlock. But the schlock in
>> the OSS world, tends to either improve, (rapidly) or die, and get
>> ignored.
>
> I agree with you, I think for me the issue is who is responsible for
> improving it. As in the intial post, its a group of geeks in their
> spare time, typically with responsibility to know one - and no real
> deadline for a fix. Now thats not something I prefer to rely upon -
> no one to litigate against when it really goes pear shaped and costs
> you a mint. But then I would only choose products with core support
> if I could.
>

You have that option with OSS, you can hire the geeks directly... When I
have a problem with OSS appfoo, I can contact the author, or the
maintainer, directly, and I get a responce from them, usually very
quickly. With CSS, I contact "customer service" well, if you grew up in
the country, you know that "service" is what a stallion, does to a
mare...

Is the support from the OSS writers perfect? of course not, but it's
been far more useful and functional for me, than the average CSS
products I've needed support for. Some CSS products have great support,
most, don't. The software is so often (for me) a side aspect of the
product, and it shows.

I am intrigued by your "geeks in their spare time" comment. Are you
making some sort of claim against the abilities of said geeks? I am
unclear on your meaning. Is it that you prefer people who only think
about the work from 8-5 M-F and only do it because they have to for a
paycheck? I personally prefer to deal with people who are writing
something to be used, than writing something to be sold. That after all,
is the real defining difference between most OSS, and most CSS, CSS, is
written to be sold, OSS, is written to be used. It shows.

>> Followups set to cola
>>
>> <huge sig, and badly quoted message, snipped.>
>
> Mine too :)
>

You chopped the followups set to cola, and readded the ms newsgroup, I
have complied with your desire to cross post this between those groups.

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-- 
Jim Richardson     http://www.eskimo.com/~warlock
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist
the black flag, and begin slitting throats."
    H.l. Mencken

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