Re: 3D programmers Salary
- From: legalize+jeeves@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Richard [Microsoft Direct3D MVP])
- Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 15:48:43 -0700
[Please do not mail me a copy of your followup]
=?Utf-8?B?S2VwbGVy?= <Kepler@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> spake the secret code
<EE25D089-4B6D-4629-8CE3-1784B9A79BF6@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> thusly:
>I have read many articles saying that 3d graphics or 3d engine programmers
>are pay less and work harder to achieve the same "Quality of life" outside of
>work.
>
>Is that true ?
Well, I haven't read any articles on this subject. I didn't even know
that IGDA had a chunk of their site devoted to it. However, the fact
that IGDA *does* have a chunk of their site devoted to it should tell
you something. For instance, web sites devoted to other disciplines
of engineering don't have such things on there because its not needed.
I have interviewed at game companies, but not worked for them. I got
the distinct impression they were not interested because they may have
considered me "too expensive" or didn't like the fact that I don't
spend every waking moment of my free time playing games. There are
those that assert that those game-a-holics are the ones who make the
best programmers for games. I don't really believe that. I currently
work at a company that makes software for IT management. I'm not an
IT administrator and I certainly have contributed significantly to
improving my employer's software during the roughly 2 years I've been
working there.
I think the game-a-holic argument has more credibility when it comes
to game designers, but not necessarily the programmers. Gaming these
days is a large team effort, not a lone cowboy effort where the few
people working on the product have to have all the skills needed to
make a great game.
I've had coworkers who have worked in gaming tell me that I wouldn't
like it. Maybe that's because its tons of work for relatively little
pay, or maybe not. They never said specifically why they thought I
wouldn't like it. I like games and gaming. I just happen to have
many other interests as well and don't spend my free time exclusively
on gaming.
I think one thing that distorts employer/employee relationships in the
gaming industry is that there seems to be an endless line of 20
something programmers fresh out of college (or younger and fresh out
of high school) who have never had a "real job" other than working in
the gaming industry. Therefore, a game company can afford to burn out
their employees and discard them since there is a huge supply of
people who want to work on games and are willing to take less pay for
the honor of working on games. Since they've never had any other work
experience, they don't know that it can be different.
When Graeme Divine came to the University of Utah to talk about Doom III,
he made no secret of the fact that this is typical in the industry and
that there are "many game programmers with exactly one title on their
resume". Because, basically they quit the industry after their first
death march working on a game.
I think its possible to protect yourself against this by asking
pertinent questions at a job interview and not be so eager to work for
a gaming company that you sell off your quality of life to do it. For
instance, ask the employer how often they work more than 40 hours in a
week. Ask the employer how they manage the business so that employees
don't have to work lots of overtime except for a brief period once per
release. (Even at my company we tend to work some overtime before
shipping.) Asking these sorts of questions will show that you are
aware of the issue and that this is important to you.
If its expected that you will work plenty of overtime on a regular basis,
ask how you are going to be compensated for this. Many employers think
that just because they tell you to work more hours that you should do that
without compensation, but clearly this is not reasonable. They'll take
advantage of you only if you let them. The only person looking out
for you in an employment relationship is you. If they tell you in the
interview that you'll be compensated, but its not written in your offer
letter that way, then you haven't really been given anything. Anything
that isn't written down isn't binding. If they tell you that you'll
be given stock options proportional to the amount of overtime worked,
for example, then make sure that's in your offer letter.
>I want to know how bad it is if it's real. For example the Ea spouse
>article, I can't believe it's like that everywhere in the industry. So
Do you have a URL for the "ea spouse article"? I'd like to read that.
>my "security" in terms of career-wise, will it be better in C# with database
>????? or something else in the business fields.
No matter what sort of programming you do, the best way to obtain
security in this industry is to constantly re-invest into your skill
set and knowledge. That may mean taking continuing education classes,
reading books, reading research papers or working on open-source
projects that have "currency" in the marketplace. An employer is more
interested in what you can do for them now than what you have done in
the past. Many of my peers recently went through job changes and
those that had not invested in keeping their skill set current
relative to market demands had to take pay cuts, move to another city,
or both. Things are better now, but the only person watching out for
your career is yourself and you need to reinvest in your skill set
regularly when the technology changes as rapidly as it does in
computing.
--
"The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline"-- code samples, sample chapter, FAQ:
<http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/>
Pilgrimage: Utah's annual demoparty
<http://pilgrimage.scene.org>
.
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